Whatever happened to efficacy?

Submitted by fire with fire on Mon, 01/16/2023 - 1:33pm

ef·fi·ca·cy
/ˈefəkəsē/

the ability to produce a desired or intended result.
"there is little information on the efficacy of this treatment"

On September 16, 2020, I posted on this board a diary called Questions about vaccine..
I confessed my utter ignorance of the topic as I was puzzled by a Business News article that reported on the "race" to get the golden goose of official approval for covid vaccine manufacture and sale. I was shocked and confused by the account that the ongoing experimental work by the various competitors were indicating an "efficacy rate" of 60% as the likely outcome of the race. In my post, I reported what I knew from discussing this topic with dozens of business associates, that most people assumed that whenever the vaccine would come out, it would keep you from catching covid -- not just reduce your chance of it.

As virtually always on this particular forum, there were knowledgeable people ready to correct my ignorance. The most cogent thought I recall from two plus years ago asserted that a good public health strategy combines vaccine's limited efficacy with the spread of natural immunity to eliminate the spread of the virus.

That made sense to me as a way to get to what was called "herd immunity." I was previously unfamiliar with that term, but that far into the national argument, I knew that some voices remained certain that there was no proof that the nation could ever get to herd immunity, while others argued for a strategy to achieve it. My ignorant take on this was that the people from all over the country I had zoom meetings with all expected THE vaccine to end the pandemic, and that it would be a disappointment if it turned out that you still had a big chance of catching covid even after getting vaccinated.

When Pfizer and Moderna won the megabuck race, of course, a host of authoritative voices promised that the shit would keep you from catching covid, period. Based on that assertion of 100% efficacy, the mandated vaccination regime kicked in, costing me my career. So long as the efficacy promise remained valid, it was a rational policy -- perhaps unwise for collateral reasons, but it made perfect sense.

Now that we can see the results, it is undeniable that the efficacy has been less than 100%. Does it even matter now? Looking at the officially reported USA case and fatality numbers, more people have been adversely impacted by covid after the vaccine campaign began than before.

So what is the efficacy rate? Is it zero? Was it ever possible to calculate?
Was it all bullshit from jump? These are not just trivial questions. They are a call for global, national and personal self-reflection.

Tags:

efficacy

Vote

Comments

Submitted by QMS on Mon, 01/16/2023 - 2:29pm

All of this garbled nonsense hosed on us by CDC

was a way of making Pharma concerns wealthier. It worked for that. Stopping Covid, not so much.
As you pointed out, vax and efficacy have very little in common with the treatment of viruses.
And yet the government is still pushing more vax as a strategy. I am seeing lawsuits coming up
which are challenging the legality of various organizations for their "mandates". Since it is now
proven covid happens with the vaxed and boosted, mandating a disproven solution is just criminal.
YMMV

—

question everything

Submitted by on the cusp on Mon, 01/16/2023 - 4:20pm

The definition of efficacy

changed with the speed of science.
So did the definition of vaccination.
So did the purpose for getting a vaccination.

—

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

Submitted by snoopydawg on Mon, 01/16/2023 - 4:39pm

Pfizer lied

There’s 2 different ways to test for efficiency and only 1 is accurate. Bottom line is that the real efficiency was only 0.84%, but Pfizer used the inaccurate one, but the real shocker is that Pfizer never tested it to see if it would block infection or transmission. This was known right after they got approval, but it slipped under the rug. It came out again when someone from Pfizer admitted that they never tested it to see if it was efficient.

Omicron blew the lid off it when people who had 2-3 jabs got infected anyway and then the bivalant one has proved to be another dud when 1 month after Walensky took it she got infected and then when she took Pfizer-mectin she got rebound Covid.

Good essay on Pfizer-mectin.

Paxlovid interacts with hundreds of other medications, so should be prescribed only a doctor who knows your medical history to avoid serious drug interactions. But in Biden’s State of the Union in January 2022, he promised Americans that they would be able to walk into a drugstore, get tested for COVID there, and if positive walk out with a prescription (for Paxlovid or Molnupiravir, he did not specifiy which one or both) without seeing a doctor.

Molnupiravir enhances mutations, in both you and the virus SARS-CoV-2, so it is the worst drug anyone should receive for COVID.

Well the chickens came home to roost and allegedly Joe Biden, Tony Fauci and Rochelle Walensky all got COVID last year. Allegedly all 3 took Paxlovid. Allegedly all 3 then had a recurrence of COVID as a result. No fooling, you are likely to get COVID again with this winner of a therapy.

Daniel Horowitz, one of my very favorite writers (he understands the science and medicine, which is not easy for a journalist and pundit) wrote about these two loser drugs below.

Where is the intellectual curiosity of millions of doctors who blindly supported expensive, experimental products without circumspection, but scoffed at every cheap, safe, and long-standing approved therapeutic to treat COVID? Whether the medical community finds its spiritual catharsis or not, House Republicans need to engage in oversight of the shots, remdesivir, and Paxlovid – including their side effects, what led to their expedited approval and purchase by the federal government, and how we stop this from happening in the future.

It’s the other novel therapy that was supposed to pick up the slack for when the gene therapy shots failed. Our government purchased, without question, billions of dollars’ worth of Pfizer’s new drug, Paxlovid, without any independent studies vouching for its safety, even though its ritonavir component is an AIDS drug contraindicated with 32 common drug categories taken by seniors, such as statins and steroids. Officials also approved it while dissing ivermectin, which uses Paxlovid’s mechanism as a protease inhibitor … plus another 19 mechanisms of action.

And look there’s the DoD again being involved in the Covid thingy….if you don’t understand the reference see the essay with the Kim Iverson video.

Now, the more we discover problems with the jabs, we’re also finding out the problems with Pfizer’s Paxlovid, which is so unquestionably supported that the FDA allowed pharmacies to dispense it without a doctor’s prescription (while denying fully approved drugs prescribed by doctors). Despite the already known and questionable issues with safety and the “rebound” effect of Paxlovid, the Department of Defense paid Pfizer $2 billion in December for another 3.7 million courses of the drug ($540 per course). This is on top of the existing $10.6 billion for the original 20 million courses. Pfizer is expected to earn $22 billion from this drug on the backs of taxpayers. For some perspective, Home Depot’s net revenue in 2021 was $16.4 billion.

There is no valid reason why anyone is being mandated to take the jabs when they don’t block infection and everyone knows that. Plus for those who say that it keeps people from getting more sick or hospitalized where are the studies that show that? There aren’t any.

Submitted by snoopydawg on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 11:40am

ARR vs RRR

@snoopydawg

Here’s an essay describing how Pfizer lied about the effectiveness of the jab and the difference between the 2 risk reductions that are used in trials.

So I’m going to do a short dig in to show you that the ARR argument is a distraction which you should let go, and explain why.

The people on the approval committee had to know that Pfizer used the wrong number and then sat back as Pfizer and moderna lied about it being almost 100% effective. Lots of people blew the whistle on this early on, but of course it was covered up and censored by big pharma. The recent Twitter files show that.

There’s 2 different ways to test for efficiency and only 1 is accurate. Bottom line is that the real efficiency was only 0.84%, but Pfizer used the inaccurate one, but the real shocker is that Pfizer never tested it to see if it would block infection or transmission. This was known right after they got approval, but it slipped under the rug. It came out again when someone from Pfizer admitted that they never tested it to see if it was efficient. Omicron blew the lid off it when people who had 2-3 jabs got infected anyway and then the bivalant one has proved to be another dud when 1 month after Walensky took it she got infected and then when she took Pfizer-mectin she got rebound Covid. Good essay on Pfizer-mectin. Paxlovid interacts with hundreds of other medications, so should be prescribed only a doctor who knows your medical history to avoid serious drug interactions. But in Biden’s State of the Union in January 2022, he promised Americans that they would be able to walk into a drugstore, get tested for COVID there, and if positive walk out with a prescription (for Paxlovid or Molnupiravir, he did not specifiy which one or both) without seeing a doctor. Molnupiravir enhances mutations, in both you and the virus SARS-CoV-2, so it is the worst drug anyone should receive for COVID. Well the chickens came home to roost and allegedly Joe Biden, Tony Fauci and Rochelle Walensky all got COVID last year. Allegedly all 3 took Paxlovid. Allegedly all 3 then had a recurrence of COVID as a result. No fooling, you are likely to get COVID again with this winner of a therapy. Daniel Horowitz, one of my very favorite writers (he understands the science and medicine, which is not easy for a journalist and pundit) wrote about these two loser drugs below. Where is the intellectual curiosity of millions of doctors who blindly supported expensive, experimental products without circumspection, but scoffed at every cheap, safe, and long-standing approved therapeutic to treat COVID? Whether the medical community finds its spiritual catharsis or not, House Republicans need to engage in oversight of the shots, remdesivir, and Paxlovid – including their side effects, what led to their expedited approval and purchase by the federal government, and how we stop this from happening in the future. It’s the other novel therapy that was supposed to pick up the slack for when the gene therapy shots failed. Our government purchased, without question, billions of dollars’ worth of Pfizer’s new drug, Paxlovid, without any independent studies vouching for its safety, even though its ritonavir component is an AIDS drug contraindicated with 32 common drug categories taken by seniors, such as statins and steroids. Officials also approved it while dissing ivermectin, which uses Paxlovid’s mechanism as a protease inhibitor … plus another 19 mechanisms of action. And look there’s the DoD again being involved in the Covid thingy….if you don’t understand the reference see the essay with the Kim Iverson video. Now, the more we discover problems with the jabs, we’re also finding out the problems with Pfizer’s Paxlovid, which is so unquestionably supported that the FDA allowed pharmacies to dispense it without a doctor’s prescription (while denying fully approved drugs prescribed by doctors). Despite the already known and questionable issues with safety and the “rebound” effect of Paxlovid, the Department of Defense paid Pfizer $2 billion in December for another 3.7 million courses of the drug ($540 per course). This is on top of the existing $10.6 billion for the original 20 million courses. Pfizer is expected to earn $22 billion from this drug on the backs of taxpayers. For some perspective, Home Depot’s net revenue in 2021 was $16.4 billion. There is no valid reason why anyone is being mandated to take the jabs when they don’t block infection and everyone knows that. Plus for those who say that it keeps people from getting more sick or hospitalized where are the studies that show that? There aren’t any.

Submitted by usefewersyllables on Mon, 01/16/2023 - 4:51pm

Please don't

tar all of science with the broad brush of the Covid example.

In this case, the "science" of "vaccination" was changed at the speed of politics.

There are always well-placed and highly-regarded people who turn out to be utter whores, and we have sure as hell seen a lot of that happening here. But science is still science, and it would be a mistake to simply scrap everything that is said in its name because of this.

They have indeed redefined "science" and "vaccine" into meaninglessness, and that is a goddamned crime against humanity. They used that to very effectively crowbar people into compliance. Now, people are blowing off *all* vaccines, as if Bill Gates and the WEF had somehow been around to bribe Jonas Salk, and that all of medicine has been a conspiracy all along. It is amusing and horrifying in equal parts to hear of the outbreaks of various essentially-eradicated childhood diseases popping up again. As a person who survived measles, mumps, and chickenpox all over a 2-week period in my childhood, I wouldn't wish that on anyone. If there is to be a great dying, that's a great way to make it happen.

There needs to be a reckoning with respect to this entire travesty, to be sure. I doubt that I'll live long enough to see it. But please retain the baby while the bathwater is being changed. Science didn't do this to us, and medicine didn't do this to us- but politics and politicians (and the money they worship) surely did. Ask any of the doctors who have had their licenses invalidated by trying to do the right thing: politics clothed in a very thin veneer of "science" did.

Science as a concept will eventually heal from this wound, and various people who aren't whores are starting to take hard looks at this. This will take time, and nobody will be satisfied in the short term. Meanwhile, the politicians will belatedly say "Mistakes were made" with their fingers crossed behind their backs, and continue to cruise merrily along feeding unhindered at the trough of infinite cash that sustains them. I'm sure that their whores are eating well, as well.

—

Twice bitten, permanently shy.

Submitted by snoopydawg on Mon, 01/16/2023 - 7:34pm

It might be because people have started looking into

@usefewersyllables

all vax safety. In 1986 drug companies told congress that unless they got immunity from lawsuits they would stop creating them and since then they haven’t been doing testing on them to make sure that they are safe. This has been known by some people, but Kennedy’s book let more people know about it and the possible problems they cause.

Here’s response on the 1986 immunity shield for big pharma.

The National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act (NCVIA) of 1986 (42 U.S.C. §§ 300aa-1 to 300aa-34) was signed into law by United States President Ronald Reagan as part of a larger health bill on November 14, 1986. NCVIA's purpose was to eliminate the potential financial liability of vaccine manufacturers due to vaccine injury claims[1] to ensure a stable market supply of vaccines, and to provide cost-effective arbitration for vaccine injury claims.[2] Under the NCVIA, the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (NVICP) was created to provide a federal no-fault system for compensating vaccine-related injuries or death by establishing a claim procedure involving the United States Court of Federal Claims and special masters.[1][3]

Worth reading to see how many vaccines were unsafe at the time.

Here’s an essay on vax safety. It’s not just questioning if they are safe from adverse effects, but if they are safe from contaminants.

I too got all the childhood diseases and I was miserable. My mom believed in disease parties where when one kid in the neighborhood got sick the other parents would take their kids over to be exposed. Mom said it was easier for all 3 of us to get sick at once instead of one at a time because she didn’t have to take as much time off of work. Single mom. Besides it was better for kids to get infected while young because the diseases were much more dangerous if contacted as an adult. I can attest to that after seeing what happened when a 39 yo male got chickenpox. It was terrible.

Unfortunately the health agencies have brought this on themselves because they lied to us so often. Gates too because of what he has been doing in countries like Africa. It was barbaric what he has and is still doing. If interested I can look for links, but any search other than google should bring results.

One more thing. Biden said that when the next epidemic hits there will be a vaccine in 100 days. The hell with safety. This bivalant was only tested on 8 mice and the jab authorization board is ticked at Moderna for not giving them any safety results on the jabs for kids.

tar all of science with the broad brush of the Covid example. In this case, the "science" of "vaccination" was changed at the speed of politics. There are always well-placed and highly-regarded people who turn out to be utter whores, and we have sure as hell seen a lot of that happening here. But science is still science, and it would be a mistake to simply scrap everything that is said in its name because of this. They have indeed redefined "science" and "vaccine" into meaninglessness, and that is a goddamned crime against humanity. They used that to very effectively crowbar people into compliance. Now, people are blowing off *all* vaccines, as if Bill Gates and the WEF had somehow been around to bribe Jonas Salk, and that all of medicine has been a conspiracy all along. It is amusing and horrifying in equal parts to hear of the outbreaks of various essentially-eradicated childhood diseases popping up again. As a person who survived measles, mumps, and chickenpox all over a 2-week period in my childhood, I wouldn't wish that on anyone. If there is to be a great dying, that's a great way to make it happen. There needs to be a reckoning with respect to this entire travesty, to be sure. I doubt that I'll live long enough to see it. But please retain the baby while the bathwater is being changed. Science didn't do this to us, and medicine didn't do this to us- but politics and politicians (and the money they worship) surely did. Ask any of the doctors who have had their licenses invalidated by trying to do the right thing: politics clothed in a very thin veneer of "science" did. Science as a concept will eventually heal from this wound, and various people who aren't whores are starting to take hard looks at this. This will take time, and nobody will be satisfied in the short term. Meanwhile, the politicians will belatedly say "Mistakes were made" with their fingers crossed behind their backs, and continue to cruise merrily along feeding unhindered at the trough of infinite cash that sustains them. I'm sure that their whores are eating well, as well.

Submitted by snoopydawg on Mon, 01/16/2023 - 8:02pm

Big pharma should have lost our trust a long time ago,

@snoopydawg

but the FDA and especially Fauci went out of their way to bury their crimes. Remember that Pfizer paid the biggest fine in history for criminal actions, but no one was charged for any.

A midwestern doc wrote a must read essay where he describes big pharma’s crimes and how they were covered up by the FDA. He includes links to his other outstanding essays on various other crimes. I suggest anyone interested in following this subject subscribe to his substack.

What Happens to Vaccine Clinical Trial Participants?

In the same way that this process occurs in interpersonal interactions, it is also done by bad actors against the population as a whole (when governments do this, it is commonly referred to as the “totalitarian tiptoe”). If you consider the whole COVID-19 “pandemic” situation, we had a series of completely absurd demands placed upon us for “emergency” reasons, and then each time one stipulation was complied with, an even more extreme one was put forward. For example, although the lockdowns had no value and resulted in enormous social costs, many are now calling for climate lockdowns (to fight the emergency of climate change), and Oxford is drafting the plans to implement them next year.

Another common abuser of society is the pharmaceutical industry. Nowadays, I am often asked how I was able to accurately predict the course of the pandemic, and my answer each time is: “all of this was just an escalation of what the industry had done previously.” As the years have gone by, the industry has become more and more brazen in pushing unsafe and ineffective medications onto the market and paying off the government to gaslight the injured parties, rather than fulfilling its obligation to investigate and pull the harmful medications.

For example, much of what has happened throughout the COVID-19 pandemic parallels the early days of the AIDS epidemic. Fauci fought to keep a variety of effective treatments for AIDS off the market so that he could push through a deadly and ineffective (but highly lucrative) drug to treat HIV, which was AZT. This is exactly what Fauci later did during COVID-19, first with remdesivir, and later the vaccines, except this time it affected all of America rather than just the gay community (who actively protested him at the time, but for all practical purposes were ignored):

ETA

This describes how Merck hid the adverse effects from the Gardisal HPV vaccine and how it both lied to the study participants and how they abandoned them after they got injured. Just like Pfizer did to Maddie DeGray. She’s in a wheelchair and has numerous problems, but Pfizer only said that she had a tummy ache. Fauci, Walensky and everyone high up in the health agencies knows about this, but still SAFE and EFFECTIVE!

My gawd. This has been legalized at by the government. Maybe if someone from Pfizer had gone to prison instead of just paying a paltry fine this wouldn’t be happening again today.

#4 all vax safety. In 1986 drug companies told congress that unless they got immunity from lawsuits they would stop creating them and since then they haven’t been doing testing on them to make sure that they are safe. This has been known by some people, but Kennedy’s book let more people know about it and the possible problems they cause. Here’s response on the 1986 immunity shield for big pharma. The National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act (NCVIA) of 1986 (42 U.S.C. §§ 300aa-1 to 300aa-34) was signed into law by United States President Ronald Reagan as part of a larger health bill on November 14, 1986. NCVIA's purpose was to eliminate the potential financial liability of vaccine manufacturers due to vaccine injury claims[1] to ensure a stable market supply of vaccines, and to provide cost-effective arbitration for vaccine injury claims.[2] Under the NCVIA, the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (NVICP) was created to provide a federal no-fault system for compensating vaccine-related injuries or death by establishing a claim procedure involving the United States Court of Federal Claims and special masters.[1][3] Worth reading to see how many vaccines were unsafe at the time. Here’s an essay on vax safety. It’s not just questioning if they are safe from adverse effects, but if they are safe from contaminants. I too got all the childhood diseases and I was miserable. My mom believed in disease parties where when one kid in the neighborhood got sick the other parents would take their kids over to be exposed. Mom said it was easier for all 3 of us to get sick at once instead of one at a time because she didn’t have to take as much time off of work. Single mom. Besides it was better for kids to get infected while young because the diseases were much more dangerous if contacted as an adult. I can attest to that after seeing what happened when a 39 yo male got chickenpox. It was terrible. Unfortunately the health agencies have brought this on themselves because they lied to us so often. Gates too because of what he has been doing in countries like Africa. It was barbaric what he has and is still doing. If interested I can look for links, but any search other than google should bring results. One more thing. Biden said that when the next epidemic hits there will be a vaccine in 100 days. The hell with safety. This bivalant was only tested on 8 mice and the jab authorization board is ticked at Moderna for not giving them any safety results on the jabs for kids.

Submitted by fire with fire on Mon, 01/16/2023 - 9:34pm

tarring with a broad brush

@usefewersyllables .

Please don't
tar all of science with the broad brush of the Covid example.

I agree with your thought here, as there is nothing wrong with science. The serious difficulty comes from determining who gets to speak for science. That effort is inherently vulnerable to manipulation by powerful individuals and organizations.

Science is not any one person or organization. It is an unending process, a set of traditions and imperfect means of insuring objectivity and honesty. It has accomplished a great deal over the course of many centuries. It is no denigration of science to apply scientific skepticism to any particular assertion of what Science says.

This is an infinitely broad brush that I have come to appreciate more than ever since the "pandemic."

tar all of science with the broad brush of the Covid example. In this case, the "science" of "vaccination" was changed at the speed of politics. There are always well-placed and highly-regarded people who turn out to be utter whores, and we have sure as hell seen a lot of that happening here. But science is still science, and it would be a mistake to simply scrap everything that is said in its name because of this. They have indeed redefined "science" and "vaccine" into meaninglessness, and that is a goddamned crime against humanity. They used that to very effectively crowbar people into compliance. Now, people are blowing off *all* vaccines, as if Bill Gates and the WEF had somehow been around to bribe Jonas Salk, and that all of medicine has been a conspiracy all along. It is amusing and horrifying in equal parts to hear of the outbreaks of various essentially-eradicated childhood diseases popping up again. As a person who survived measles, mumps, and chickenpox all over a 2-week period in my childhood, I wouldn't wish that on anyone. If there is to be a great dying, that's a great way to make it happen. There needs to be a reckoning with respect to this entire travesty, to be sure. I doubt that I'll live long enough to see it. But please retain the baby while the bathwater is being changed. Science didn't do this to us, and medicine didn't do this to us- but politics and politicians (and the money they worship) surely did. Ask any of the doctors who have had their licenses invalidated by trying to do the right thing: politics clothed in a very thin veneer of "science" did. Science as a concept will eventually heal from this wound, and various people who aren't whores are starting to take hard looks at this. This will take time, and nobody will be satisfied in the short term. Meanwhile, the politicians will belatedly say "Mistakes were made" with their fingers crossed behind their backs, and continue to cruise merrily along feeding unhindered at the trough of infinite cash that sustains them. I'm sure that their whores are eating well, as well.

—

I cried when I wrote this song. Sue me if I play too long.

Submitted by Lookout on Tue, 01/17/2023 - 9:00am

We were had...

first by exaggerating the severity and implying everyone was at risk, and then with the experimental gene therapies they called vaccines.

I continue to think it was a plandemic used to enforce more control over the sheeple.

TPTB are already planning another pandemic since the last one worked out so well for them.

—

“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”

Submitted by enhydra lutris on Tue, 01/17/2023 - 2:19pm

I recall that I, at least once in the early days,

explained what "efficacy", at the time a term of art, meant and how it didn't say anything substantive about the proposed vacine(s) ability to protect one from the virus.

For the record, they select two groups of people who don't have the virus, give one group the "vaccine" and not the other. The members of each group are instructed to notify them if they get the virus. After a period of time the compute the fraction of each group that got the virus. They then compute an "efficacy" value from the difference between the two fractions. Though allegedly "scientific" because "statistics" the process is post hoc ergo propter hoc.

be well and have a good one

—

That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

Submitted by fire with fire on Tue, 01/17/2023 - 3:08pm

That is how I understood it

@enhydra lutris but the Business article from the autumn of 2020 bandied the term around as though it was the most significant factor in the approval process. And the random unscientific sample of the people I knew at the time in my work were unanimous in their expectation that the coming vaccine would work.

—

I cried when I wrote this song. Sue me if I play too long.

Submitted by snoopydawg on Tue, 01/17/2023 - 5:39pm

Maybe….

@enhydra lutris

Peter Doshi published a series of editorials (summarized here) in the British Medical Journal (BMJ - considered to be one of the top 5 medical journals in the world) that explained why the design of the vaccine trials and the evidence for Pfizer’s vaccines was very poor, and could not justify an FDA approval. Sadly, his experience with his colleagues mirrored my own, and his points were almost entirely ignored by the medical profession.

One of Doshi’s many observations was that there were signs in the data that the trial was not blinded, and the entire benefit of the vaccine may have been due to a failure to test vaccinated individuals for COVID-19 (thus creating the illusion that vaccinated individuals were less likely to have laboratory-confirmed COVID-19).

Submitted by dystopian on Tue, 01/17/2023 - 3:29pm

herd immunity my hooves

The entire response has been Pfraud. Every step of the way.

First the concept of herd immunity is only applicable to an immunity conferring vaccine.

There was no immunity conferring vaccine, which means there was no such thing as herd immunity. They knew that. Lots of us did. Only some were allowed the mic, dissenters were deplatformed.

As OTC mentions, the very definition of vaccine was CHANGED. By the CDC, Oxford and one of the other big dictionary people (Webster or F & W mehtinks) in concert.

So they could call an expermental mRNA gene therapy, a vaccine. And no one blinked!?!

Pfizer lied about its efficacy, and they lied about its bad side effects. They knew it.

They did not even study much less prove its safety. The early signals were clear. So three years later there still were never Stage 3 trials. Pitiful. Disgraceful. There is no science in it. Science would want those answers.

The only immunity these vaccines conferred was to the manufacturer and sellers, the drug dealers. They killed people. They knew. They mandated compliance. It is evil what they did.

They invented the prior unknown "speed of science" for it. Which despite Pfizer's claims, still does not exist.

They had a funny little man saying "I AM SCIENCE". That proceeded then to say things that defied science.

We are still denying that it is aerosol, calling it droplets that can move throughout a room. Aerosols FFS! Like all other repiritory viruses. Three years and an intelligent response has not been mustered.

Due to the politicization of the response, how will people believe say climate or biological science now?

These F'rs have done more to undermine the credibility of ALL science than any act in history. Pfizer, for a buck.

Without seller immunity these shots would not be out there for sale.

We collected no data, in order to not know how bad it was. To hide it as long as possible, to sell more shots.

The gov would not allow discussion of any non-Pfizer approved (shot) response. All social media monitored for questioning authority and dissent. Why were they not promoting Vitamin D from Day 1? They knew they werelying. Paxlovid is a $1000 joke compared to early pennies on IVM it seems.

We fired people and they lost careers, over BS mandates to take an experimental viral gene therapy. By calling it a vaccine. By lying to them. And called it science.

Whilst we not just denied any and all non shot interventions but censored them. And cancelled those that had the unmitigated audacity to question authority. Doctors have had licenses pulled. CA has a new crazy law against doctors or scientists having a second opinion!?! That is what we have done to science.

At the behest and authority of Pfizer. The people that have paid the biggest billions in fines for selling shit that killed people. That is who is calling the shots here. They own the media, politicians, and government including former regulatory bodies of FDA and CDC.

I can't imagine how it went wrong.

Had the people the basic scientific knowledge to really understand what things like efficacy, vaccine, immunity conferring, and herd immunity meant, they never could have snowed the public using the terms.

They screwed climate science as collateral damage. They really really do not care, except for money and power.

my dsl is in and out, so had time to rant off line ... hope to get a chance to post it...

—

We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.
Look deep into nature, and then you will understand everything better.
both - Albert Einstein

Submitted by QMS on Tue, 01/17/2023 - 3:36pm

Righteous rant dysto

@dystopian

It is getting more difficult, as time goes on, to estimate the damage these greedy fucks have
done to our society and the world. It may get worse. IDK

Sacrificing the sanctity of science for making a buck is beyond immoral.

The entire response has been Pfraud. Every step of the way. First the concept of herd immunity is only applicable to an immunity conferring vaccine. There was no immunity conferring vaccine, which means there was no such thing as herd immunity. They knew that. Lots of us did. Only some were allowed the mic, dissenters were deplatformed. As OTC mentions, the very definition of vaccine was CHANGED. By the CDC, Oxford and one of the other big dictionary people (Webster or F & W mehtinks) in concert. So they could call an expermental mRNA gene therapy, a vaccine. And no one blinked!?! Pfizer lied about its efficacy, and they lied about its bad side effects. They knew it. They did not even study much less prove its safety. The early signals were clear. So three years later there still were never Stage 3 trials. Pitiful. Disgraceful. There is no science in it. Science would want those answers. The only immunity these vaccines conferred was to the manufacturer and sellers, the drug dealers. They killed people. They knew. They mandated compliance. It is evil what they did. They invented the prior unknown "speed of science" for it. Which despite Pfizer's claims, still does not exist. They had a funny little man saying "I AM SCIENCE". That proceeded then to say things that defied science. We are still denying that it is aerosol, calling it droplets that can move throughout a room. Aerosols FFS! Like all other repiritory viruses. Three years and an intelligent response has not been mustered. Due to the politicization of the response, how will people believe say climate or biological science now? These F'rs have done more to undermine the credibility of ALL science than any act in history. Pfizer, for a buck. Without seller immunity these shots would not be out there for sale. We collected no data, in order to not know how bad it was. To hide it as long as possible, to sell more shots. The gov would not allow discussion of any non-Pfizer approved (shot) response. All social media monitored for questioning authority and dissent. Why were they not promoting Vitamin D from Day 1? They knew they werelying. Paxlovid is a $1000 joke compared to early pennies on IVM it seems. We fired people and they lost careers, over BS mandates to take an experimental viral gene therapy. By calling it a vaccine. By lying to them. And called it science. Whilst we not just denied any and all non shot interventions but censored them. And cancelled those that had the unmitigated audacity to question authority. Doctors have had licenses pulled. CA has a new crazy law against doctors or scientists having a second opinion!?! That is what we have done to science. At the behest and authority of Pfizer. The people that have paid the biggest billions in fines for selling shit that killed people. That is who is calling the shots here. They own the media, politicians, and government including former regulatory bodies of FDA and CDC. I can't imagine how it went wrong. Had the people the basic scientific knowledge to really understand what things like efficacy, vaccine, immunity conferring, and herd immunity meant, they never could have snowed the public using the terms. They screwed climate science as collateral damage. They really really do not care, except for money and power. my dsl is in and out, so had time to rant off line ... hope to get a chance to post it...

—

question everything

Submitted by ovals49 on Tue, 01/17/2023 - 7:31pm

You were smart to “wait and see”

@QMS
I caved but waited for adenovirus and DNA (J&J - single dose) jab. Those who climbed on the mRNA train, complete with follow on ‘boosters’ are going to to be facing the risk of ‘high zone tolerance’ (suppressed IgG3 and augmented IgG4) and a weakened immune response across the board, not just with regard to COVID.

I’m still hoping for mucosal vaccine products for future respiratory viral pathogens. Administration by injection bypasses the first line of defense, the nose and throat. Unfortunately, TPTB are still Hell-bent on pushing a problematic mRNA platform that has already amply demonstrated its impotence with regard to curbing respiratory viral pathogens.

—

“ …and when we destroy nature, we diminish our capacity to sense the divine,and understand who God is, and what our own potential is and duties are as human beings.- RFK jr. 8/26/2024

Submitted by QMS on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 7:22am

basically just mule headed

@ovals49

the more I absorb of the mass distractions, the less I trust the messengers of said
I still believe, without a doubt, this is primarily an airborne virus - so react accordingly
building air filters for indoor use is (imho) more important than applying astringents
also, strengthening the immune system is vastly more effective than taking a jab
just the fact that the CDC and FDA disregard these protocols makes me suspect
their intentions to properly fight disease is not in our best interest

thanks for weighing in

edited to add not

—

question everything

Submitted by janis b on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 12:23am

Hi ovals

@ovals49

I so hope that my daughter and all who I love fare well after having been vaccinated. I think that is my greatest wish.

All the best to you and all here and everywhere.

Submitted by ovals49 on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 4:38am

I also wish for the best for all.

@janis b
But, as far as hope goes, changes will required. If we continue on our current trajectory, in regard to so many aspects of global socio-economic policies, we can only expect the quality of life to degrade, humans not excepted.

With regard to our western health ‘care’ systems, immediate changes are paramount. The current elephant in the room is the burgeoning disaster of our failed ‘pandemic response’ especially with regard to mRNA products that never stopped either infection or transmission of COVID. But they did cause an unprecedented number of adverse events, many of which can be life changing or life ending. Continuing with mass injections of these still experimental mRNA products needs to stop. FULL STOP.

—

“ …and when we destroy nature, we diminish our capacity to sense the divine,and understand who God is, and what our own potential is and duties are as human beings.- RFK jr. 8/26/2024

Submitted by janis b on Fri, 01/20/2023 - 7:38pm

Maybe there should be a campaign,

@ovals49

like on cigarette packages, where each injection comes with some horrible feature of its after effects.

Submitted by ovals49 on Fri, 01/20/2023 - 8:03pm

Better yet the FDA should simply withdraw the product,

@janis b
and embrace preventive and curative FDA approved products that have actually been proven ‘safe and effective’ (mRNA are neither) and get working on a more traditional vaccine administered not by injection but through nasal mucosa. It is a respiratory virus after all. Injecting systemically was a very bad idea as mRNA material ends up circulating widely throughout the body and vital organs, causing a raft of possible problems, some of which are life changing or life ending.

Besides, no one reads those black box warnings and then decides to stop smoking. It’s just a head fake that allows deleterious products to remain in the marketplace, perpetuating profits at the expense of health.

—

“ …and when we destroy nature, we diminish our capacity to sense the divine,and understand who God is, and what our own potential is and duties are as human beings.- RFK jr. 8/26/2024

Submitted by janis b on Sat, 01/21/2023 - 1:57am

I agree with your insightful conclusions

@ovals49

Regarding embracing preventive and curative products, this from New Zealand Doctors Speaking Out with Science ...

What will you do to save your health & that of your children?
What will you do for happiness, wealth & a life well lived?
Without our health, these precious aspects of our lives are either not obtainable or meaningless.
https://nzdsos.com/2023/01/18/hatchardl-therapeutic-products-bill/

Lots of food for thought and health in that article.

Submitted by ovals49 on Sat, 01/21/2023 - 3:01am

Good to hear government overreach getting pushback in NZ

@janis b
Big pharma seems to have forgotten that many (most?) of their now patentable drugs are synthetic derivatives of molecules first discovered in the plant world. The roots of traditional medicine are based on thousands of generations of trial and error and empiricism, no double-blind RCT’s necessary. Limiting access to these non-patented natural products in favor of pharmaceutical surrogates is not in the best interest of the public. It only benefits profits of corporations and their ‘friends’ in government.

—

“ …and when we destroy nature, we diminish our capacity to sense the divine,and understand who God is, and what our own potential is and duties are as human beings.- RFK jr. 8/26/2024

Submitted by janis b on Sat, 01/21/2023 - 1:59am

deleted double

@ovals49

Submitted by snoopydawg on Tue, 01/17/2023 - 5:52pm

Yep righteous rant

@dystopian

However….

So three years later there still were never Stage 3 trials. Pitiful. Disgraceful. There is no science in it. Science would want those answers.

Remember that they unblinded the control group and gave them the jabs so there’s no way they can come to a valid conclusion. And one essay I read talked about how the CDC published a limited hangout when they said that the jabs can cause strokes a few weeks after getting jabbed. People can get strokes much longer than a few weeks because the spike proteins keep getting manufactured and no one knows when they stop making them. Plus there are plenty of other adverse effects that can happen from day 1 to who knows how long which they aren’t going to talk about. This study was released on Friday just before a holiday weekend. Is the media covering the study or did they just move on to the hypocritical speech Biden gave at MLK's church? Biden who helped write the racist crime bill and said things like this his entire career in congress…

Anyone interested in reading it?

Also wouldn’t you think that when a brand new virus started killing people that Fauci and friends would have wanted to know everything they could about it and do autopsies to find out how it’s killing people? Instead autopsies were frowned upon and people were just buried.

I hope people looked at the essay I posted by Midwestern doc. He goes into great detail about how people in vaccine trials are abandoned if they get adverse effects.

Here is part 2.

He focuses on how fraudulent the Pfizer trial was. This never should have been approved and now that numerous problems have come to light they should be removed from the market. Besides the one that has gotten full approval isn’t available in America.

The entire response has been Pfraud. Every step of the way. First the concept of herd immunity is only applicable to an immunity conferring vaccine. There was no immunity conferring vaccine, which means there was no such thing as herd immunity. They knew that. Lots of us did. Only some were allowed the mic, dissenters were deplatformed. As OTC mentions, the very definition of vaccine was CHANGED. By the CDC, Oxford and one of the other big dictionary people (Webster or F & W mehtinks) in concert. So they could call an expermental mRNA gene therapy, a vaccine. And no one blinked!?! Pfizer lied about its efficacy, and they lied about its bad side effects. They knew it. They did not even study much less prove its safety. The early signals were clear. So three years later there still were never Stage 3 trials. Pitiful. Disgraceful. There is no science in it. Science would want those answers. The only immunity these vaccines conferred was to the manufacturer and sellers, the drug dealers. They killed people. They knew. They mandated compliance. It is evil what they did. They invented the prior unknown "speed of science" for it. Which despite Pfizer's claims, still does not exist. They had a funny little man saying "I AM SCIENCE". That proceeded then to say things that defied science. We are still denying that it is aerosol, calling it droplets that can move throughout a room. Aerosols FFS! Like all other repiritory viruses. Three years and an intelligent response has not been mustered. Due to the politicization of the response, how will people believe say climate or biological science now? These F'rs have done more to undermine the credibility of ALL science than any act in history. Pfizer, for a buck. Without seller immunity these shots would not be out there for sale. We collected no data, in order to not know how bad it was. To hide it as long as possible, to sell more shots. The gov would not allow discussion of any non-Pfizer approved (shot) response. All social media monitored for questioning authority and dissent. Why were they not promoting Vitamin D from Day 1? They knew they werelying. Paxlovid is a $1000 joke compared to early pennies on IVM it seems. We fired people and they lost careers, over BS mandates to take an experimental viral gene therapy. By calling it a vaccine. By lying to them. And called it science. Whilst we not just denied any and all non shot interventions but censored them. And cancelled those that had the unmitigated audacity to question authority. Doctors have had licenses pulled. CA has a new crazy law against doctors or scientists having a second opinion!?! That is what we have done to science. At the behest and authority of Pfizer. The people that have paid the biggest billions in fines for selling shit that killed people. That is who is calling the shots here. They own the media, politicians, and government including former regulatory bodies of FDA and CDC. I can't imagine how it went wrong. Had the people the basic scientific knowledge to really understand what things like efficacy, vaccine, immunity conferring, and herd immunity meant, they never could have snowed the public using the terms. They screwed climate science as collateral damage. They really really do not care, except for money and power. my dsl is in and out, so had time to rant off line ... hope to get a chance to post it...

Submitted by on the cusp on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 9:17am

Let's not forget a company named Anser.

They won the award for funding the vax. They then hired Moderna and Pfizer.

—

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

Submitted by fire with fire on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 10:32am

From my 2020 diary

J.P. Morgan Lays Odds On the Race to a COVID-19 Vaccine

The world needs a vaccine against COVID-19, and with some 200 vaccine candidates in various stages of development, and more than 30 of these vaccines already in Phase 3 clinical trials, odds are we will get a vaccine -- probably several -- sooner than you might expect.

J.P. Morgan analyst Cory Kasimov focused in on two of the leading candidates: mRNA-1273 from Moderna (MRNA), and BNT162 from BioNTech (BNTX), laying odds on which of the two has the best chance of success -- and which might win FDA approval first.

Kasimov's note, it should be pointed out, is not intended to be an exhaustive discussion of all 30 leading vaccine candidates, or even a thorough review of the two vaccines focused on. Rather, explained the analyst, he just "wanted to get a better sense of the likelihood of success in Phase 3 for two of the front runners in the vaccine race." As such, the report should perhaps be best viewed as a sort of first look at two good prospects to rank among the winners of this race.

/snip/

Simulating potential results of the Phase 3 trials, Kasimov notes first and foremost that "both trials should ultimately be successful if efficacy rates are anywhere north of 60%." (I.e. The FDA will probably approve both companies' vaccines if they are 60% or more effective at preventing infection, relative to patients receiving placebos). It appears that the FDA could approve vaccines with efficacy rates of 50% or even as low as 30% -- but 60% is preferable, and 70% or better would all but assure approval of both companies' vaccines.

The race is on. Seven billion customers is the finish line. Wall Street is betting on the various research organizations like horses at the Belmont Stakes. That makes capitalistic sense, although it begs some really difficult questions like once some vaccines are "approved," who decides which one to use? Who is going to pay for them? How are they going to be distributed?

Although until yesterday I had not bothered to look into the actual nuts and bolts of creating and distributing a vaccine, I did make a decision months ago that I would fight to the death rather than let anybody in THIS culture stick a needle in my arm. I knew nothing about how vaccines are created, tested, approved and used, but I do know that we are run by a confederacy of charlatans, gangsters and morons. Whoever wins this capitalistic "race" will be the fastest, not the best, contestant. In a country where respectable publications still claim that Putin put Trump in the White House, I do not see how anybody can trust our society to put out a safe and effective product.

Did I use the word, effective?

It never occurred to me in 67 years on this planet and after having been vaccinated for polio and small pox as a child that the vaccine itself might not work. The doctor in the underground video used the term efficacy, which struck me as weird. If the shit does not work, why shoot it into people?

And there it is -- the business section of Yahoo! News. The best anybody can hope for is 70% efficacy? And 30% would fly?

Excuse me, but what the fuck is the point of this? "Congratulations. You have just been given a 70% chance of not getting Covid-19. Or maybe more like 30%? So keep wearing your mask and keep your social distancing until everybody has taken the vaccine. And then keep wearing the mask because there is between a 30% and 70% chance that anybody can STILL spread the virus."

I am not attacking the concept of vaccine. I remain agnostic on that topic. But this idiotic "race" is beyond insane. The tragedy is that the majority of the people I know in real life complacently believe that once we get a vaccine, we can get back to normal. I hear it on virtually every Zoom meeting I'm on.

The faith in Science is all that anybody has left as our social institutions are crumbling before our eyes. Surely Science can save us. It is an echo of religion in our secular age. The idea that there is no solution to a problem is inconceivable to Americans -- all we have to do is get the politics out and let Science do its thing. The ideology of the Book of Genesis has ruled the world for several thousand years and our effort to control the environment has allowed the population to grow to 7 billion.

Nature is fighting back now and nature is winning.

Perfect irony for this End of The World -- the business page article shows clearly that the vaccine obsession is all about who gets to make the windfall profit of selling hundreds of millions of doses of Maybe to a terrified citizenry. "Efficacy" is but a sales point.

Maybe is the best we can hope for.

—

I cried when I wrote this song. Sue me if I play too long.

Submitted by on the cusp on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 12:08pm

I spoke with a client this morning

and she mentioned her husband died last month. As the talk progressed, I learned he dropped dead from a heart attack. So did his two best friends. All in their early 60s, all healthy, all required to get vaxxed and boosted.
No autopsies.
Their booster was a combo of Pfizer and Moderna.
All 3 widows are sad, angry, and helpless to get even with whoever is responsible.
Before she came in, I interviewed a client about her late husband's death. He was sick with flu, but pumped full of remdesvir. He was sent home, died a week later from the flu, for which he was refused treatment.
Can't wait to hear from my afternoon clients.
whoopee.

—

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

Submitted by snoopydawg on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 12:54pm

Lots of people who were said to have died from the Rona

@on the cusp

actually got the flu and some type of pneumonia that they weren’t given antibiotics for. Why? Because doctors were told in 2019 to quit prescribing it for them. Now why in the blue Fck would that order have been given after decades of people with pneumonia being given it? I posted a link to this a few doses back.

And never forget what happened in nursing homes worldwide. Mengele is green with envy.

Submitted by snoopydawg on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 12:42pm

Interesting videos

More doctors are calling for the end of the massive jabs campaign before it’s too late. Pharma has been illegally advertising for the jabs without talking about the risks which they must do according to the law. I’ve been watching the X files free with ads and there are quite a lot of drugs being advertised and every one of them have the risks either talked about or written in the scrawl. It’s the law. But not with these untested and experimental jabs? Wtf?!

CRIMINAL CHARGES: Top U.S. Cardiologist calls for the Bill Gates Foundation, World Economic Forum, World Health Organization, U.S. Government, Pharmaceutical Suppliers and others to be charged with illegal advertising, fraud and mass negligent homicide. pic.twitter.com/NzzfWPZfIt

— Truth Justice ™ (@SpartaJustice) January 13, 2023

Fertility rates have been going down everywhere long before they released the jabs, but now they are going down even faster.

Submitted by QMS on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 2:29pm

Not sure how the courts would react to wrongful death suits

@snoopydawg

but, as in civil cases? Or class action suits? Perhaps the pharma industry is insulated,
but there remains the niggling questions of corporate over-reach
in terminating health care professionals without legal standing.
As the vax is being proven to be both ineffective and harmful,
there should be a push back from the groups and individuals
effected by this charade.

—

question everything

Submitted by snoopydawg on Wed, 01/18/2023 - 3:42pm

Fraud isn’t covered by immunity

@QMS

and there is lots of information showing that Pfizer committed it during their trial. Midwestern doc covers some of it. But it’s true that there have been lots of legislation passed over the decades bringing us to this point, but no one should be able to pass legislation that allows them to commit crimes. That’s pretty much what they have done. But can they make laws saying that it’s not a crime to commit murder? That is when the courts should have stepped in, but congress made them so they couldn’t. But I’d sure love to see a case challenging this.

So far there have been suits against mandates that have crushed them and Brook Jackson has a case against Pfizer for fraud during the trial at one place. It’s going slowly, but if I see anything I’ll post it.