Windows 10 Leak Exposes Microsoft's New Monthly Charge

This was obvious when you think about it. You used to get disk copies of pre-installed programs. Word, Excel, and PowerPoint were provided to give you a platform to work from. They ended that years ago. But this is worse. It’s an outrageous scam,

Windows 10 Leak Exposes Microsoft's New Monthly Charge

Ever since its creation, Microsoft has described Windows 10 “as a service”. The fear has always been that this meant Microsoft would start charging users a monthly fee to maintain the operating system, and now a new leak has confirmed this is exactly what will happen…

In a new report, CNet’s well connected Microsoft specialist Mary Jo Foley reports the company will soon launch ‘Microsoft Managed Desktop’ which will charge a monthly fee to configure computers running Windows 10 and keep them running smoothly as new updates are released.

Foley also notes “Microsoft already has a number of the pieces in place to make this happen” such as a Windows Autopilot automatic device provisioning service, device financing programs like Surface Plus and a ‘Surface as a Service’ leasing program. Microsoft also has a subscription bundle including Windows 10 and Office 365 called Microsoft 365 and Windows 10 Enterprise subscription plans.

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So what’s the good news? At this time, Foley believes Microsoft Managed Desktop will be targeted at businesses. But the obvious question, given the clear direction Microsoft is moving becomes: for how long?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2018/08/04/microsoft-windows-10...

Microsoft Warns Windows 7 Has A Serious Problem

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In short: Microsoft has made a seemingly small yet completely bizarre tweak to Windows Update on Windows 7 and confirmed it is crippling many users’ PCs.

The tweak? It switched the status of Windows 7 update KB3133977 from ‘Optional’ to ‘Recommended’. The bizarre part? Despite acknowledging the problems, Microsoft knew they would occur in advance and it has no plans to do anything about it.

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Now 27 years old, Asus is one of the largest PC component makers and supplies motherboards to many of the world’s biggest PC makers. Recently it enabled Secure Boot in UEFI on all its motherboards. This wasn’t a problem for older PCs because Windows 7 didn’t support Secure Boot, that is until KB3133977 came along in March and enabled it.

Initially the fallout was small. Asus confirmed the problem, Microsoft confirmed the problem. But the best news was KB3133977 was an optional Windows 7 update so it had to be manually installed to take effect. The solution was simple: just steer clear of KB3133977 (aka do nothing) and you’d be fine.

Then last month – for some bizarre reason – Microsoft made KB3133977 a ‘Recommended’ update. The result was every user running Windows 7 and default Windows Update settings (the vast majority) would find the update now installed automatically.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2016/05/04/microsoft-warns-wind...

Well this should really complicate the internet ‘user’ experience. Silicon Valley has figured a way to keep your data ‘safe’ for a monthly fee. You’ll never really own your data anymore, you’ll have to pay a fee to the greedy bastids just so you can even access it. How will this effect those who can barely afford the exorbitant rates internet carriers charge?

The initial cost and development of the internet was NOT by Billy Gates or Steve Jobs. It was developed for use by the military and paid for with tax money. WE should be collecting a monthly fee from those guys for using the internet that we paid for.

Who invented the internet?

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The first workable prototype of the Internet came in the late 1960s with the creation of ARPANET, or the Advanced Research Projects Agency Network. Originally funded by the U.S. Department of Defense, ARPANET used packet switching to allow multiple computers to communicate on a single network. The technology continued to grow in the 1970s after scientists Robert Kahn and Vinton Cerf developed Transmission Control Protocol and Internet Protocol, or TCP/IP, a communications model that set standards for how data could be transmitted between multiple networks. ARPANET adopted TCP/IP on January 1, 1983, and from there researchers began to assemble the “network of networks” that became the modern Internet. The online world then took on a more recognizable form in 1990, when computer scientist Tim Berners-Lee invented the World Wide Web. While it’s often confused with the Internet itself, the web is actually just the most common means of accessing data online in the form of websites and hyperlinks. The web helped popularize the Internet among the public, and served as a crucial step in developing the vast trove of information that most of us now access on a daily basis.

http://www.history.com/news/who-invented-the-internet

Greedy bastids.

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The Aspie Corner's picture

They're looking for anything they can use to keep nickel-and-diming us. Sure, they've already pocketed everything that hasn't been nailed down and left us with a near dead planet, but even that isn't enough for them.

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Modern education is little more than toeing the line for the capitalist pigs.

Guerrilla Liberalism won't liberate the US or the world from the iron fist of capital.

Amanda Matthews's picture

@The Aspie Corner

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I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks

Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa

detroitmechworks's picture

Who never updates his Windows 7, hit NO on every single upgrade offer, and downloads almost all my software directly to disc, mostly using open source options and mods if available.

Don't I realize how DIFFICULT I'm making everything? It's be so much easier to just let Microsoft handle building my computer, coding the OS, and generally being a friendly helpful corporation that I should totally trust...

With that in mind, no, I believe I'll be hanging onto my paper check, VA. Nah, gonna stick with cash, corporate America. No thanks MIC, I don't think you need a copy of my DNA on file.

[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypr18UmxOas]

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I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

Lookout's picture

free open sourced OS
https://www.ubuntu.com/

I just got a little laptop with linux and learning to use it. My desktop still runs on Windows 7 - however I don't have auto updates - so maybe they haven't sabotaged my system yet.

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“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”

thanatokephaloides's picture

@Lookout

Time to move to linux

free open sourced OS
https://www.ubuntu.com/

Multimedia fans should check out Ubuntu Studio https://www.ubuntustudio.org . This Ubuntu distro is free, open-source, non-profit, and is maintained by lovers of computer multimedia (audio/video).

If anyone reading this is running a machine based on the Intel Bay Trail or Cherry Trail multicore processor ICs, please drop me a message.

We need to get serious about exorcising the capitalist assholes from our computers (for which we've paid) and our data and our information lives.

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

arendt's picture

@thanatokephaloides

I only know Intel Graphics HW by names such as HD4600.

Googling for Bay Trail on Wikipedia fails.

Does UbuntuSTudio require Intel graphics HW of a certain type?

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@arendt

Does UbuntuSTudio require Intel graphics HW of a certain type?

No. All discrete graphics hardwares are fully supported, to my best knowledge and belief.

The "Bay Trail" and "Cherry Trail" ICs are multicore processors with onboard audio and graphics hardware. They're mostly used in tablets, with some application in laptops (including my Toshiba Satellite C55-B5480 series). Linux kernels have had some issues with these ICs until a certain developer, Ian "Linuxium" Morrison, developed patches and support code for these machines. This Comment is being created under Linuxium operating system code on my end.

The ICs are also known as the "Atom" series.

Smile

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

arendt's picture

@thanatokephaloides

I had seen "atom" processors; but I never bothered to own a tablet. Seems like a big cellphone. Just not a good tradeoff of form factor and feature set.

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Hetrose's picture

@thanatokephaloides Thanks for the info. Been working up a hatred for Microsoft and Windows for a long time. Will look into this.

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TheOtherMaven's picture

@Lookout

it screwed around with my little laptop.

When/if I get another computer it will run Linux.

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There is no justice. There can be no peace.

thanatokephaloides's picture

@TheOtherMaven

Turned automatic update off the second time it screwed around with my little laptop.

When/if I get another computer it will run Linux.

And I'm happy to help in any way I can -- just let me know.

Smile

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

arendt's picture

since, duh, 2016.

I have refused all updates; but somehow, they forced a reboot of my machine so that when i went to open Office, I got this "The Fine Print" splash screen demanding that I sign a new EULA (End User License Agreement) in order to get at a new version of Office 2016 that magically appeared on my machine with the reboot.

Bottom line: They broke into my machine, they stole my paid-for software, and they are holding me up for ransom.

It took several days to even find out what was going on. At first, users who were worried this was some kind of malware kept asking M$ to confirm or deny that. Eventually, in some obscure M$ forum, they claimed the whole thing was a "mistake" they made. They claim an update accidentally caused the system to think any attempt to open Office was for a brand new copy.

Yeah, right. That's why a brand new copy magically appeared on my machine.

----

I am so done with these slimy crooks. I'm putting Ubuntu on my machine ASAP.

Also, I'm buying a RAID1-NAS box. These are sometimes called "personal clouds". I completely agree that I do not want my info in the cloud. And why should I, when keeping it safe at home costs about what you would pay for cloud storage for a year? Not to mention backing up critical stuff on thumb drives.

Basically, a RAID1 box has two disks each with a copy of the same files. If one goes down, you can rebuild it from the other. Of course, if you want to "hot swap" the dead drive, you will have to pay a few bucks extra. But, I found a 4TB (x 2) box for about $400 at B&H Photo
Video (where I buy all my electronics in order to avoid the Amazon monster).

Thanks for this news and fuck microsoft sideways. Rotten bastards from day one.

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k9disc's picture

My GF was recently screwed on an international flight - late flight, no connections - and there was zero recourse.

MS. Zero recourse.

Banks? Zero recourse.

Over and over, the rules and power of the consumer have changed. We have gone from customer to consumer over the last few years, and I don't think many of us noticed.

Consumers, unlike customers or citizens, have no recourse.
@arendt

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“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

@k9disc why you would think that customers or citizens have any recourse...because they don't.

Everything has become crapified and we pay more and more.

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dfarrah

k9disc's picture

get courted and maintained.

Microsoft doesn't give a shit about the enduser, fucking them mercilessly. But the IT departments of Fortune 200 companies are customers and get the treatment required to keep and maintain that relationship.

The citizen does have powers that consumers lack. The fact that we're being conned out of using them, or using them properly doesn't mean that those powers don't exist.

It is crappier and crappier, but that's because we're not exercising the rights of the citizen and the customer.

@dfarrah

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“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

@k9disc may have it wrong.

"But the IT departments of Fortune 200 companies are customers and get the treatment required to keep and maintain that relationship."

Really? Where else are they going to go? MS has monopoly powers. It's more like IT departments are stuck with MS.

And what powers do citizens have? You haven't heard about the studies that show that representatives don't represent their constituents' interests? The reps do the bidding of the powerful interests.

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dfarrah

k9disc's picture

big corporate level.

The idea is to rope companies in to lucrative services contracts, so it's a long term customer relationship. It bears zero resemblance to consumer treatment. I did inside sales for a large computer firm that was not MS back in the 90s.

B to B is completely different from B to C.

@dfarrah

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“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

thanatokephaloides's picture

@dfarrah

I don't quite get why you would think that customers or citizens have any recourse...because they don't.

Everything has become crapified and we pay more and more.

There's irony here: as WinDoze becomes crappier and crappier, Linux keeps getting better and better! And it's still available for free!

Smile

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

I beg to differ. Windows 10 isn't an operating system - its an advertising platform.

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@sny

operating system?

I beg to differ. Windows 10 isn't an operating system - its an advertising platform.

The term "clusterfuck" applies perfectly, as it did from day 1 of Windows 3. Quoting the Free Software Foundation:

"Microsoft uses draconian law to put Windows, the world's most-used "operating system", completely outside the control of its users. Neither Windows users nor independent experts can view the system's source code, make modifications or fixes, or copy the system. This puts Microsoft in a dominant position over its customers, which it takes advantage of to treat them as a product."

punctuation adjusted

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

Citizen Of Earth's picture

@sny
That is the real issue for me.

The live tiles in the start menu are simply advertisements. I shut all of those off. But your computer is still constantly (many times an hour) using network bandwith to download Ad data. And burning CPU cycles to scan your system for advertising markers. This chews about 30% CPU utilization on my i5 machine 10-15 times an hour for several minutes. I run a small program that watches for the M$ utilities that do this and kill them as soon as they start. It's pathetic.

I would have moved to Linux years ago but still need Windoze for developing software. At some point, I will just say enuff is enuff.

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Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.

Arrow's picture

I was running Linux 0.98 at the time and just upgraded to 1.13 (way more stable and somewhat legandery).
Downloaded and compiled NCSA Mosaic 'web browser'. I was so proud of myself when I got the 'globe to spin' in he top right corner. At the time you could only navigate though HTTP to NCSA and CERN. But you could also use it as a FTP client(which I did most of the time). That's where Linux started for me. Overnight downloads on a dial up connection to FTP.HUT.FI/pub/linux/.

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I want a Pony!

thanatokephaloides's picture

@Arrow

The start of the web for me...

I was running Linux 0.98 at the time and just upgraded to 1.13 (way more stable and somewhat legendary).
Downloaded and compiled NCSA Mosaic 'web browser'. I was so proud of myself when I got the 'globe to spin' in he top right corner. At the time you could only navigate though HTTP to NCSA and CERN. But you could also use it as a FTP client(which I did most of the time). That's where Linux started for me. Overnight downloads on a dial up connection to FTP.HUT.FI/pub/linux/.

spelling corrected

Memories! I certainly remember overnight dialup downloads!
(I, too, go back that far!)

So what is your opinion about how Tutankhamun governed us, way back when? And is that memory why you want a Pony? Wink

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

supenau's picture

This has happened. As my online job depends on Windows office, PowerPoint, etc they are getting just under 10.00 a month from me. My computer guy suggested Libre, however that’s not supported by the university. So even though I work on my personal computer and paid once for office’s previous versions of the program, when I signed up for the “free” 365 version a year or two ago, they hooked me. And yes it is a scam waiting for a class action suit(one can hope). So right now it’s a business expense. For what it’s worth

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Amanda Matthews's picture

@supenau

Apachbe OpenOffice Product Description

Compatible with other major office suites, Apache OpenOffice is free to download, use, and distribute.

Writer a word processor you can use for anything from writing a quick letter to producing an entire book.

Calc a powerful spreadsheet with all the tools you need to calculate, analyze, and present your data in numerical reports or sizzling graphics.

Impress the fastest, most powerful way to create effective multimedia presentations.

Draw lets you produce everything from simple diagrams to dynamic 3D illustrations.

Base lets you manipulate databases seamlessly. Create and modify tables, forms, queries, and reports, all from within Apache OpenOffice.

Math lets you create mathematical equations with a graphic user interface or by directly typing your formulas into the equation editor

http://www.openoffice.org/product/index.html

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I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks

Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa

Wink's picture

or Mac.
Screw Windows, run on Linux instead!
As much as it is a pain in the ass to learn the quirky navigation - after 20 years Linux STILL hasn't made themselves anywhere close to User Friendly - once you spend a couple three days on the learning curve you're good to go!
And thanks to the virtual gods, VirtualBox makes it easy.
ok, easier.
(trust me, it used to be a Real pain)!
So just DL and install the FREE (key word) VirtualBox for your PC or Mac.
(need about 2-4 gigs of Ram and about 50-150 gigs of HD space available)
just follow the Install destructions here for a great How To for VirtualBox installation - AND Linux install once VirtualBox is installed! Go step by step and you can't go wrong. DL and install any virgin of Linux you like - After you have VirtualBox installed.
Need help holler.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-2.1) All about building progressive media.

arendt's picture

@Wink

VirtualBox is a cross-platform virtualization application. What does that mean? For one thing, it installs on your existing Intel or AMD-based computers, whether they are running Windows, Mac, Linux or Solaris operating systems. Secondly, it extends the capabilities of your existing computer so that it can run multiple operating systems (inside multiple virtual machines) at the same time. So, for example, you can run Windows and Linux on your Mac,

https://www.virtualbox.org/manual/ch01.html

That is, the hypervisor sits ON TOP OF a platform (Windows, Mac, Linux) that you choose, and it lets you run different OSs in Virtual Machines. But the virtual machines are all being managed by your platform.

Here is what Wikipedia has to say about hypervisors:

Type-1, native or bare-metal hypervisors

These hypervisors run directly on the host's hardware to control the hardware and to manage guest operating systems. For this reason, they are sometimes called bare metal hypervisors. The first hypervisors, which IBM developed in the 1960s, were native hypervisors.[4] These included the test software SIMMON and the CP/CMS operating system (the predecessor of IBM's z/VM). Modern equivalents include AntsleOs[5], Xen, XCP-ng, Oracle VM Server for SPARC, Oracle VM Server for x86, Microsoft Hyper-V, Xbox One system software, and VMware ESX/ESXi.

Type-2 or hosted hypervisors

These hypervisors run on a conventional operating system (OS) just as other computer programs do. A guest operating system runs as a process on the host. Type-2 hypervisors abstract guest operating systems from the host operating system. VMware Workstation, VMware Player, VirtualBox, Parallels Desktop for Mac and QEMU are examples of type-2 hypervisors.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypervisor

So, if you are running Windows, and you download VB, any Linux that runs on VB is depending on Windows for system hypervisor services. The VB hypervisor does NOT replace Windows.

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Wink's picture

to imply that it did.
@arendt
It obviously runs on your computer's firmware, hardware infrastructure.
But, if you have 2-4 gigs of ram and 50 gigs of free hard drive space you're good to go. VirtualBox simply makes it easier to install (and run) Linux on your computer. Something not all that easy to do without these virtual gizmos. VirtualBox does all the setup for us. We don't have to spend days configuring this and configuring that. VB does all that hokus pokus for us.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-2.1) All about building progressive media.

arendt's picture

@Wink

Your purpose seems to be to run Linux apps in a Windows environment. You don't seem to mind that Windows still controls your machine, that Windows is free to update your machine with spyware. If I understand you, you figure that being able to avoid Windows apps is good enough, and that you will live with the Windows OS.

But the point of the thread is that M$ wants to eventually move everyone to an "as a service" basis, so that they get to collect a monthly fee from you for breathing. Today, that AAS model is in place for Office365 - where users who can't do arithmetic are shelling out $120/yr for the privilege of using M$'s crap (but standard crap) software. That's not enough for them. They want all users to pay rent for Office; and as the OP points out, they want all users to pay rent for the damned, broken, bloated, spying OS.

My purpose is to go to full Linux in order to get M$ out of my face, so I can stop worrying that some update that they force on me is going to force me into paying rent. Virtual Box is of no help to me in that regard.

I recognize that it is some bit of work to use Linux, but the alternative is to bow down before M$.

Could you please let me know if I have correctly understood your purpose? Thanks.

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Wink's picture

I thought it works
@arendt
like a thumb drive. It shows as a 'Drive' on my Mac, but apparently it's somehow NOT running Linux separately, as an os, but somehow just running Linux apps via OS x.
Weird.
So, what's the point of that?
Just to be able to run the apps on your pc?
They're Not that remarkable. (except Airtime).
It gives the impression that it's running Linux. As the os. It apparently ain't.
So, it's back to partitioning your drive.... what a pain in the ass.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-2.1) All about building progressive media.

arendt's picture

@Wink

could be an answer.

Modern equivalents include AntsleOs[5], Xen, XCP-ng, Oracle VM Server for SPARC, Oracle VM Server for x86, Microsoft Hyper-V, Xbox One system software, and VMware ESX/ESXi.

They are an OS-equivalent that sits right on the "metal". All the virtual machines, no matter what OS, are running on top of the hypervisor. the problem is finding one that is affordable for home use.

In the list above, obviously, you don't want the Hyper-V or Xbox - because they are M$ products. Oracle stuff is pricey, and besides, Larry Ellison is another creepy megalomaniac billionaire. I think VMware is good stuff, but its for businesses and will be priced for that. Never heard of AntsleOs[5], Xen, XCP-ng.

Dual partitions are a pain. M$ Windows rigs up its partition to make it hard to repartition. (What else would you expect?) They put some trivial file at the far end of their disk space, which makes it hard to compact their partition. There are ways around it, but you need to use certain repartitioning tools; and you need to know what you are doing.

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@Wink

As much as it is a pain in the ass to learn the quirky navigation - after 20 years Linux STILL hasn't made themselves anywhere close to User Friendly

Have you tried Ubuntu Studio lately? Or any of the several other Ubuntu flavors with built-in GUI systems?

The navigation is far from "quirky", and once the system's installed, you can set the navigation up so it matches typical Windows navigation exactly.

Also: you don't need an hypervisor like VirtualBox to try Linux out. Just create a "live boot" medium per your system's requirements (usually a bootable USB stick) and try it out without installing it at all.

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

arendt's picture

@thanatokephaloides

XXX "studio" keeps popping up for me. For example, Rstudio is a GUI that makes R look like MATLAB.

Is Ubuntu Studio part of the standard distro? If not, who makes it?

Thanks for your interesting information.

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@arendt

Is Ubuntu Studio part of the standard distro? If not, who makes it?

Ubuntu Studio is a fork of Ubuntu made and maintained by the Ubuntu Studio community.

A community project

Ubuntu Studio is a community effort, created by volunteers, targeted towards all skill levels, from beginner to pro, and aims to be easy to install and easy to use, as well as provide all the tools necessary for any type of media content creation.

What we do..

We aim to be an example on how to configure a Debian based operative system for our workflows, contributing in bringing improvements upstream to Debian, and communicating with developers directly, by doing testing, fixing bugs and providing feedback.

Our goal

We aim to be a the gateway for users coming into the Linux world, wanting to use Linux for multimedia content creation, by providing applications and documentation, as well as being a portal to other GNU/Linux and FLOSS communities in the world.

spelling corrected

from the "About" page on the Ubuntu Studio website

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

arendt's picture

@thanatokephaloides

I tried to go to the Ubuntu Studio address, but it timed out for me.

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@arendt

Thanks I tried to go to the Ubuntu Studio address, but it timed out for me.

Try again? I just opened the site at http://ubuntustudio.org/ with no problems.

Smile

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

"All your data are belong to us"

It feels like the race to control every piece of data has started. I hope that there are some kind of remedies for this, because it's every big internet players wet dream, and the government prob. thinks that's A-OK. Why control free speech if you can control it's dissemination.

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Wink's picture

need to build our
@Snode
own local publicly-owned internet-connect company.
If we can't control our own gateway we're pretty much controlled by the gate keepers.
Get billed every three months like we do for garbage pickup. $119 ever 3 mos. should do it.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-2.1) All about building progressive media.

@Wink We taxpayers paid for it - we should get service for free.

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dfarrah

Wink's picture

I'll take $39 /mo.
@dfarrah
internet all day long - about half what I'm paying now.
Just using it for email, FB, C99, don't need the broadband??
$19 / month.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-2.1) All about building progressive media.

@Wink way too high. Wink

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dfarrah

arendt's picture

@Snode

They are trying to kill "ownership". Not only do they not want you to own software; they want you to not own any product containing software. The salient case here is tractors. Companies like John Deere claim farmers only lease the tractors, and they have no right to repair it except by calling John Deere.

So, add "right to repair" to "right of first sale".

They are trying to turn us into peasants - people with no rights and no property. Amazon is the "company store", where you get to spend your company scrip.

It is sad how clueless the supposedly conservative people are about this assault on the fundamental right to own property.

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@arendt completely unaware.

It's just that the liberal side doesn't hear their side.

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dfarrah

@Snode
The US government, a wholly owned subsidiary of Goldman-Sachs

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I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.

enhydra lutris's picture

tux-1

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That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

Maybe 3/4. I am assuming it's like Facef**k, you rent a Microsoft product, and they essentially have access to your data. They wouldn't want their product used the *wrong* way. The ISP's are also monitoring data (we know when you've been bad or good so cough up $1,500 for that copy of "Hey, Jude" you downloaded illegally). Then there is open source Linux that can prob. be monitored, it's just not as popular as MS stuff. Then there is encryption and VPN. I am not so sure how it can't be monitored. Encryption seems bulletproof. The search for alien signals falls apart because if it's digital we prob. can't decode it. VPN seems good, but I just can't see it being hack proof. I know there's non MS products, and search engines that supposedly don't track you. So, I guess I'm asking what can we do to not be captured by this stuff?

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arendt's picture

@Snode

The ISP's are also monitoring data (we know when you've been bad or good so cough up $1,500 for that copy of "Hey, Jude" you downloaded illegally).

I'm not clear if the ISP can monitor the content you download from BitTorrent. But certainly using BitTorrent puts a flag up on you.

Then there is open source Linux that can prob. be monitored, it's just not as popular as MS stuff.

Well, at least its not the Linux itself doing the monitoring. You can examine the code of Linux. If there were any trackers/monitors in that code, they would have been discovered and called out. So, the monitoring falls back to the same as ISP.

Then there is encryption and VPN. I am not so sure how it can't be monitored

.

Apple's encryption seems pretty serious, given what a noise was made about the FBI being unable to crack it. (But they called in some Israeli firm that could. Geez, it seems like the Israelis own monitoring the internet.)

Both file encryption and VPN make life harder for Big Brother. He has to expend resources to break in. But with the Bluffdale, UT site storing every last bit that is sent on the internet, they don't have to crack everything. They wait until they suspect someone. Then they only crack that person's files/emails. So, if you are a big fish, like Assange, they have plenty of resources to apply. However, if you are one little fish among millions of other little fish, you might not be noticed.

Encryption seems bulletproof.

Perhaps double encryption (encrypting an already encrypted text) is beyond cracking at this time. But single encryption may not be. There are also persistent rumors that the crypto standards have had weaknesses built in.

VPN seems good, but I just can't see it being hack proof.

Same story as crypto.

I know there's non MS products, and search engines that supposedly don't track you.

Here, you are differentiating between Big Brother tracking you and commercial surveillance for marketing and data.

-----

Bottom line: if you are an average person, it is hard to stay private. Certainly don't store info in the cloud. Use hard drives and thumb drives in your home that you control. Don't put those devices online. As for the data they collect when you go searching, I am a little uneducated. I know TOR, The Onion Router, is supposed to be a good anonymizer. (Certainly using it will put you on a "bad guy" list, because TPTB don't like you trying to do that.) But, again, there are rumors that the NSA knows how to crack it. Supposedly they lurk at the entrance/exit nodes and correlate TOR traffic with known ordinary traffic.

I haven't felt much need to protect myself yet. I am not an activist. I do not hand my contact info out to random strangers for political purposes. If I were to decide to become active, I would think more deeply on privacy than I have in this response.

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I know they can monitor content on BitTorrent downloads. The only thing stopping warrants for theft is that the ISP's will only forward letters, not turn over your name (for now). Don't ask.

I guess my concern is the whole monitoring and surveillance data collection thing. The computer/internet is one thing. Phones linked to them along with smart devices, and the databases that can be hacked.I can't even think about chip level backdoor hardware. It's depressing.

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I purchased a laptop with win 10 on it and then had to wipe it and put Linux on so it would actually work. Also, I'm running windows 7 on my desktop and have installed all the recommended updates without any issues. FYI.

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@jbob runs on XP.
I only installed updates that were needed for stability. I only run it in Tax season (it's a very old computer). TT has gotten so bad to use (in your face ads every time you enter something) that I;m actually glad that Trump wiped out my itemized deductions. Now I can go back to paper and pencil.

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I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.

thanatokephaloides's picture

@jbob

Windows 10 sucks! I purchased a laptop with win 10 on it and then had to wipe it and put Linux on so it would actually work. Also, I'm running windows 7 on my desktop and have installed all the recommended updates without any issues. FYI.

punctuation adjusted due to format change

So when are you migrating your desktop to Linux? (And yes, I advocate doing just that.)

Wink

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

that he copied from the Naval Postgraduate School.
MSDOS itself is a knockoff of CP-M with a simplified (crippled) interface and vastly reduced price.
Gates' true vocation was as Robber Baron, stealing and cheating his way to the top. Giving the Devil his due, he is very very good at it. Perhaps the Best.

Don't use Microsoft products unless your employer forces you to. I'm typing this on a Linux system that is every bit as functional as Windoze and has programs that can read and write Excel and Word files. Some very very good programmers maintain these for love of programming and a belief in software for the good of all mankind. It's actually easier than the labyrinthine process that MS uses to keep their people from knowing too much.
WARNING! RedHat Linux is a for profit corporation. Do not trust them.
FreeBSD is good too, just not as prevalent.

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I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.

thanatokephaloides's picture

@The Voice In the Wilderness

Don't use Microsoft products unless your employer forces you to. I'm typing this on a Linux system that is every bit as functional as Windoze and has programs that can read and write Excel and Word files. Some very very good programmers maintain these for love of programming and a belief in software for the good of all mankind. It's actually easier than the labyrinthine process that MS uses to keep their people from knowing too much.

Preach it, The Voice In The Wilderness!!

WARNING! RedHat Linux is a for profit corporation. Do not trust them.
FreeBSD is good too, just not as prevalent.

The Ubuntu base is also from a for-profit corporation (Canonical Limited in the UK), but they're open about their business model, which doesn't involve charging for Ubuntu. Instead, Canonical makes its money supporting large enterprise clients throughout the world who use Ubuntu. This is really clever if you think about it for a moment: nearly all the R&D to solve Ubuntu problems is done by the Ubuntu community for free, and Canonical then charges its enterprise customers to implement, support and maintain them. Canonical is making a fine profit while doing this, and meanwhile offering the software itself for free.

Compare/contrast that with MicroShaft's one!

As for the BSDs (Berkeley UNIX in all but name), they're excellent server operating systems, but leave something to be desired for end-user desktop use. But as Shockwave Flash fades off into the twilight as a standard Internet technology, the BSDs are catching up. TrueOS (formerly PC-BSD) is a pretty good desktop OS in the BSD family.

For most of the folks here, however, I'd recommend sticking to Linux. The Linux distributions ("distros") we've been discussing are geared towards the desktop and the typical desktop end user.

Smile

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides