Going Green or Voting Dem: My Own Evolution from the 80s to Now

Confession time.

In the 90s, I supported the Democratic party. I could have gone to join the nascent Green Party in the late 80s. Instead, I chose to work within the system. I voted for the Clintons twice. I wanted to vote for Nader, but let myself get talked into voting for Gore. I voted for Kerry. OK, I started to the left of Kerry, because I was a Dean supporter, but I "came home" in the general. And anyway, supporting Dean--I meant well, and at the time, being a Dean supporter was the way to be a voice of resistance--but how "left" or "alternative" was it, really?

I even left the academic world in 2005 to concentrate full time on getting Democrats elected at all levels. Progressive Democrats, of course, but Jared Polis was considered a progressive Democrat, so the lines were much more partisan than ideological.

I'm bringing this up because an essay could be written about me and my political history that would draw the same conclusions about my character as a recent essay on this site is drawing about Sanders.

Now imagine for a minute that I betrayed everybody on this site by going to DKos and committing character assassinations on everybody here, lifting selective quotations from things said on this site and then distorting them to inflict maximum damage.

What would you say then? Would you say "Well, it's not that surprising, because CSTS never was all that much of a progressive, certainly not a revolutionary, and it's not really strange or surprising to see that she has betrayed the hell out of all her political allies--after all, look what she was doing in the 80s and 90s! Totally a partisan Democrat, working within the system for the Democratic machine! I don't know why you all are so surprised that she stabbed this site, and everybody on it, in the back! You should have seen it coming! That's just who she is!"

But actually, it would be surprising and shocking, and worthy of speculation into my motives, if I, one of the people who first came up with the idea of this site, did something like that. Because no matter how "establishment" I was in the 90s and early oughts, the progress of Daily Kos (and the Democrats) into bullying corruption DREW A LINE I COULD NOT IGNORE.

The Democratic party has changed through history, and those changes make an impact on people's perceptions of the Democratic party, and on their subsequent choices. The Democratic party we see today revealed in all its horrible corruption was not the vision I had of the Democratic party in the 90s and early oughts. Whether the organization was merely hiding its malfeasance more effectively then, or whether the party actually has descended into greater and greater levels of corruption over time doesn't really matter. What matters is that I, and others, thought the Democratic party was a salvageable institution. We believed we could change it. We believed we could change it from within. We thought it could be made a vehicle for good. It wasn't until 2011 that I gave up all hope of doing so, and for some people, it wasn't until this year.

Now, about Bernie.

We know that Bernie made the decision, in the 90s, to work in alliance with the Democratic party. It was a deal--he got into Congress and got to get amendments passed in exchange for him helping the Democrats suppress a challenge to the duopoly in VT.

I understand that he believed in working within the system for reform (like I did at the time), and believed that going outside the system was a waste of time/useless/worse than useless, (like I did, more or less, at the time) and therefore made some deals I don't like along the way (which I too have done, if I'm going to be honest; I'm disgusted with myself that I voted for Bill Clinton, not once, but twice.)

I don't dispute that Bernie made that insider choice.

But his subsequent choice to back Hillary at all costs is still shocking and distressing. Here's why.

To get a reformist to go outside the establishment, the establishment has to cross an interior moral line held by the reformer, do something so egregious that the reformer can no longer tolerate being part of the process. When that happens, it usually looks something like this:

[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhFvZRT7Ds0]

For me, the line was crossed when the Democrats embraced the Bush tax code without even getting a clean debt ceiling raise, and followed that up with some of the most anti-democratic behavior I've ever seen in the subsequent games Obama and Boehner together played with the debt ceiling. That was my personal line. I know that might sound like an odd choice for what pushes one over the edge, but the implications of embracing the Bush tax codes permanently, with the added horror of giving Boehner room to refuse to lift the debt ceiling, in a transparent move to bully a cowardly Congress into cutting Social Security and lowering taxes further, did it for me. (Oddly enough, for somewhat different reasons, that period of DC politics was also what sent Mike Lofgren across his personal line http://www.mikelofgren.net/)

So why am I shocked and distressed about Bernie's choice to support Clinton?

The Clinton machine's atrocious behavior during this campaign, up to and including blatant election fraud, did not take Bernie Sanders across his personal, internal, ethical line. It has for millions of people, but not for him.

When the Democratic party purged people from the party rolls in multiple states by hacking their voter registration data--

When it bribed public officials to purge people from the rolls altogether, including in the place where Sanders grew up, for God's sakes--

When it rewrote caucus rules on the fly to deny Bernie supporters a voice and arbitrarily eliminated delegates from being counted--

When it portrayed Bernie supporters as dangerous, violent thugs by smearing them in the press with lies, giving rise to people threatening to come to Philadelphia with baseball bats to take care of the "BernieBros--"

--none of these things took Bernie Sanders across his internal ethical line. None of them inspired him to say "Enough is enough." None of them made him so sick at heart that he felt he needed to lay his body on the gears. And none of that is explained by ill-advised decisions to go "establishment" in the 80s and 90s, any more than my decision to go back to Daily Kos and play footsie with the bullies there would be explained by my votes for Dukakis, Clinton, Gore and Kerry.

In the 80s and 90s, the "lesser of two evils" rationale was a lot more plausible. As the hopeful beginning of the Obama era declines further and further into utter nightmare, and the idea that the Democratic party is salvageable dies its slow, hard death, very large numbers of people have shed their loyalty to this machine because of its horrific behavior, which has confronted people with their own internal moral limits--the line, whatever it is, that each individual won't, can't, cross.

Why I am shocked is that Bernie Sanders has continued to be loyal despite that horrific behavior. We've gone from being good partisan soldiers to moving outside the system. Why won't he?

There are only two possible reasons I can think of:

1)Bernie Sanders has a moral code that allows for voter purges, election-rigging, and voter intimidation. His line wasn't crossed. (This possibility has implications I'll discuss below.)

2)Bernie Sanders is going against his own moral code. His internal line has been crossed, but he's continuing to behave as a good soldier because of some external pressure, whether bribery or threats.

If the former, then Sanders was lying to us from the beginning, because his whole schtick of "political revolution" was based on voter empowerment, and voter empowerment is completely undone by election fraud. Especially by unchallenged election fraud. Sanders has no message without the fundamental belief in voter empowerment--and the Dems just showed everyone that voter empowerment is off the menu.

That means Sanders was a sheepdog, a treacherous bastard who never meant anything he said. Because none of those great policies he likes to talk about can be accomplished using his strategy of "political revolution" without empowered voters and an accurate vote count.

If the latter,
then Sanders is being pressured into acting against his personal moral compass, either by bribes or threats. Speculation abounds as to which it is, and what, specifically, they were.

It's been said that speculating about threats to Sanders engenders despair, feelings of powerlessness, and other bad feelings that don't move us forward. I agree that despair and powerlessness do us no good, that we've speculated on his motives enough at this point, and should probably move forward into envisioning positive things *we* want to accomplish. But I don't think escaping despair into the comfort of "Oh, he's been an establishment guy since the early 90s" is feasible, because the explanation doesn't erase the profundity of the decision he just made. This year, not twenty-five years ago, Sanders made the decision not to break with an organization which has revealed itself as implacably corrupt and unjust--unjust in such a way that none of his plans or policies can possibly be brought to fruition within the arena of its power.

He is remaining loyal to something that not only breaks with the fundamental ethics of American democracy, but also makes impossible everything he said he wants for this nation.

That decision is in no way comparable to the decision to work within the system in the 90s and oughts. This is a Harlan County moment.

[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nzudto-FA5Y]

Either he's treacherous, or he's under pressure. I don't see a third option.

I found what Cornel West said here to be a helpful frame for moving forward. From 15:03 to 17:40 it's particularly good:

[video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OcJqjgB4tyQ]

EDIT: The author of the other piece has chided me, and rightly so, for implying that he made conclusions about Sanders' character in his essay. *I* made conclusions about Sanders' character based on his essay, and then wrote this essay making more; I apologize for making the implication that he was the one who did so.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

as an expression of disrespect to those who see it differently.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Unabashed Liberal's picture

reasonable that there might be a 'middle ground' option. If my head isn't splitting tomorrow, I'll post my clarification on HW's thread, since my earlier reply was so muddled, he couldn't figure out what I was saying.

Wink

But, for now, I'll just leave folks with a brief excerpt and link. It mentions that Bernie's campaign started out somewhat as an 'issues' campaign.

Here's an excerpt:

Early Missteps Seen as a Drag on Bernie Sanders’s Campaign

By PATRICK HEALY and YAMICHE ALCINDORAPRIL 3, 2016

. . . He was originally skeptical that he could beat Mrs. Clinton, and his mission in 2015 was to spread his political message about a rigged America rather than do whatever it took to win the nomination. By the time he caught fire with voters this winter and personally began to believe he could defeat Mrs. Clinton, she was already on her way to building an all but insurmountable delegate lead.

Competing aggressively against Mrs. Clinton in 2015 was not part of the Sanders strategy when he announced his candidacy last April. Rather, in early campaign planning meetings, Mr. Sanders made it clear that he was focused on bringing his liberal message to cities and towns across America while also fulfilling his duties in the Senate. . . .

Please consider giving the article a peek--it purports to quote Jane Sanders, Bernie (I think), Tad Devine, Jeff Miller, etc.

Nice essay, CStS. I agree that we'll likely never know the entire story-- which I can live with.

My current concern is keeping my eyes on this treacherous crowd in the 114th Congress, so that I can assess the damage that they inflict on Everyone, on their way out the door!

Biggrin

Hey, have a good one!

Mollie


“I believe in the redemptive powers of a dog’s love. It is in recognition of each dog’s potential to lift the human spirit, and, therefore, to change society for the better, that I fight to make sure every street dog has its day.”
--Stasha Wong, Secretary, Save Our Street Dogs (SOSD)

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

Pricknick's picture

I had, for the majority of my voting life, believed that there was good on both sides of the isle. That there were good and bad republicans, democrats, independents and all other political parties.
Then the rat-fucking began. The republicans have excelled at it which is shown by how many governmental seats (other than the president) they have taken in the last 8 years. And now, low and behold, the democratic party has arrived at the novel approach of "If you can't beat them, join them".
As for Sander's, I don't believe he thought he had a chance of winning. He wanted to make a change in the system. Regardless of what he thinks now, minds have changed, but the system did not.
I say sheepdog.

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Regardless of the path in life I chose, I realize it's always forward, never straight.

He's been in Washington a long time, and he knows the dramatis personae better than any of us. He could honestly believe that LOTE is still the way to think about what is still a binary choice in this year's election. He's passed enough amendments to know that you have to play the game to get a piece of what you want, and it's possible he's made a deal with Hillary we won't see the fruits of until next year. He's no fool, and he's been pretty independent and honorable for someone who's been in Congress as long as he has.

I'm looking at his current behavior as a useful reminder not to put my eggs in a personality basket to make my political goals happen. Bernie's primary campaign was very important, and I think it will change politics in the years to come. But that campaign is over, and now he's doing something else. I don't owe him allegiance for his past campaign when he's no longer conducting it. He's back to playing the insider game in Congress, and I'll pay attention to what he's up to, but I don't feel the need to defend him or explain his actions away at this point.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

deals in pressure and threats as much as in extending political favors, so I tend to think "pressured."

But I'm on the same page w/you when it comes to "that campaign is over, and now he's doing something else. I don't owe him allegiance for his past campaign when he's no longer conducting it."

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

lunachickie's picture

the Clinton machine deals in pressure and threats as much as in extending political favors, so I tend to think "pressured."

we are (pretty much Smile ) of like mind on this.

Even if we weren't, I like that we are having this discussion, it's important, whether we agree with you or Henry or whoever.

I don't owe him allegiance for his past campaign when he's no longer conducting it.

Right! No one does. It's another reason why I can't get real upset when he opens his mouth--he played with fire, he got burned and for whatever reason, it took away his fight and he chose to go no further. He owns that choice. I don't. For whatever reason, he did what he did. No matter what we think of him, one thing we should understand (and others have said it like this, so I'm borrowing it, because it's perfect) is he's not coming back, but the movement remains.

There is no point in taking his actions personally anymore, as hard as it was (and still is) to take. NotMeUs was as true when he entered the race as when he exited. The closest to his policies of the remaining candidates appears to me to be Jill Stein, so that's who I'll vote for.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

That's good.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

his motives, or his current activities without more facts.
I really can't convince myself he is a sheepdog because he had no particular reason to be one. His senate seat is his until he retires, he is on some powerful senate committees...and working inside with the ptb democrats for decades, he would have known there was no pushing left opportunities.
He is about as moral a man as politics allows.
Facing down threats looks like the most credible explanation, but again, I just do not have enough facts to assess.
I do know this: he will not swing his supporters to vote for Hillary. He is making himself a hack politician.
He did matter.
He does not matter now.

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"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

pswaterspirit's picture

Bernie appears to have martial arts training perhaps years of it. The principle is called yeild. When an opponent advances you make yourself relaxed when the opponent pushes on you there is no resistance you stay standing the opponent loses his balance.

I am not finding his Hillary stumps very compelling in that he doesn't seem to be putting much energy into them. I compare that to the u tube recording of his speech at standing rock which did have his normal energetic delivery.

I have voted democratic since 1984. Not this year perhaps never again. I await the unfolding of events.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

thanks for giving me a way to complicate the binary.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

katchen's picture

or something like it: radical pragmatism. Maybe we'd have to be Bernie's age to understand it, with as many years of political experience behind us as he. He has surely met with countless obstacles and disappointments, but the guy always lives to fight another day.

This third option doesn't preclude option #2.

But option #1--that he was lying from the start--is not one I will ever accept.

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gulfgal98's picture

Thank you for putting it far more concisely than I ever could.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

is still mighty hard to take.

As Rev Barber said in another context "It's mighty low."

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

It's not just looking back --- I think he's looking ahead. The sacrifice keeps him at the table doing what he thinks is right. She will fall under her own weight.

I flatly refuse to be down on Bernie.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

I'm actually not mad at him at all. It's more like pity and sadness than anything else.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

... being in politics and understanding and playing the hand you are dealt. The lowest level threat that would have elicited his response is removal from committee leadership. I think he thinks he's got one more election in him before retirement, why not continue to do the best he can while he's still in public service?

He's lit the fire ... up to the rest of us to continue loading fuel and fanning flames.

I'm not speculating on whether or not there were physical threats without real evidence. Nor will I pity him. I am saddened that he's not the nominee, but that's as far as that will go. If we are collectively right, establishment will realize they really do need to change --- Bernie (or whoever comes after) as a hostage will never be enough. Not him. Us.

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pswaterspirit's picture

Theory is that they threatened Vermont. It makes so much sense to me. Every state is vulnerable in some way. I come from a state that had such a political hit put on it once by Ronald Reagan. He was attempting to oust our senator at the time Henry M Jackson who we liked so much he has his own memorial highway. Reagan was attempting to sell Bonneville Power even though the 4 NW states are ahead on the repayment of the 100 year mortgage. Jackson wiped the floor with him Smile State has been anti republican ever since.

Vermont is his weak spot and we'll with in their ability without having to go all mobster.

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What principle does martial arts training apply when the aggressor targets your family? I can fit Bernie's response to the treatment HE received into your third option. But from the beginning a great deal of the Clinton campaign's effort, including comments by Paul Krugman and Connie Schultz, wife of Sherrod Brown, were directed at Bernie's supporters. The slandering and attempts to frame (e.g. chair throwing, English only) Sanders' supporters culminating in harassment at the DNC are an issue of a different order of magnitude. He could have started quietly and gradually escalated his comments into the public discussion. He didn't.

Also, this third way with invisible concessions delivered at some future time sounds a lot like 11 dimensional chess.

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lunachickie's picture

He could have started quietly and gradually escalated his comments into the public discussion. He didn't.

Even if internal pressure of any sort was not brought on him, "Public Discussion" availability is only as good as the outlets actually facilitating it to reach the public. Have we forgotten all the media blackouts of Sanders drawing so many to his rallies?

We have got to get past the idea that he could have "fought back in the public domain" and done so to any great degree successfully. Look at all the editing they've done for Hillary. Corporations decide what you see and hear as "news".

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There is simply no doubt that Bernie could have conveyed to his supporters his sense of outrage on their behalf. The MSM was trying to get a Sanders response to the removal of Nina Turner. Eventually they turned to others who did not have a real sense of what happened and the story fell flat.

Bernie could have addressed his supporters through the web. You just can't keep that kind of response a secret.

Why didn't he do it? Trump? Conversations stopping when he walks into the senate lunchroom? Financial considerations? Maybe all of the above and probably more.

If by success you mean walking out and uniting with Jill Stein to lead the Green Party to victory, I agree with you. It wasn't going to happen and it could have added to the probability of Trump. But options range across a continuum. I haven't heard much about Bernie reaching out personally to people who gave substantial pieces of their lives to his campaign. There must be some. I hope people will share.

I think multiple factors are involved in any complicated decision. I imagine the thought that he could do something that set off something that improved Trump's chances played a major role in his thinking. I don't think the carrots were irrelevant.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

right now!

I think the probability of Trump would be considerably less with a Sanders/Stein ticket.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

The probability of Trump may be damned high, but not as high as it would be if Bernie were in the race as a third party candidate.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

Because that doesn't seem at all obvious to me.

When they were all in the race, Bernie was popular with a wide range of people, Trump was popular with a small range of people, and Clinton did what she always does--start with a huge structural advantage and blow it.

The idea that Bernie would somehow split the vote with Clinton insuring a Trump win makes all kinds of assumptions about the electorate that are outmoded and don't take into account Hillary's vortex-like horribleness as a candidate.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

The NV caucus/"thug Bernie supporters" meme was, to me, damned close to an actual physical threat, because I know how the "thug" meme is used in this culture.

It also produced one of the nastier moments of the campaign, when a Hillary supporter came on Twitter and made the comment "Don't worry, Barbara Boxer, we'll take care of it. All we need is 50 supporters from each state to go to Philly with baseball bats..."

I sent that Tweet to whoever manages Boxer's Twitter account, and said, basically, "Is this what you had in mind? Might want to get out in front of this."

Of course, they didn't. Maybe it is what they had in mind.

Luckily, AFAIK, nobody did show up to Philly w/baseball bats.

But throwing that sort of suggestion around in this day and age is as inadvisable as, for instance, saying you're staying in a presidential primary against a Black man because you never know what might happen, and, after all, Bobby Kennedy was assassinated in CA in June.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Raggedy Ann's picture

No looking back. The primary is over. Nothing is changing. If something changes, we'll discuss it. Re-hashing this over and over ad nsuseum needs to stop.

We need to focus on moving forward.

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"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11

riverlover's picture

but we do look again like a roomful of cats. I won't say herd, because that is not a collective noun for Felis.

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Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.

A group of cats is a "pride."

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Centaurea's picture

"Pride" refers specifically to lions.

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"Don't go back to sleep ... Don't go back to sleep ... Don't go back to sleep."
~Rumi

"If you want revolution, be it."
~Caitlin Johnstone

You've never met my cats. Smile

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Centaurea's picture

I call my boy cat "my little lion". He's a big boy with yellow fur, a fluffy ruff (mane), and a mighty roar.

The lion he most resembles, when he gets a certain expression on his face, is Bert Lahr's Cowardly Lion in the Wizard of Oz, and his ferocious roar is mighty sweet. But don't tell him I said that. He has his pride, after all. Biggrin

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"Don't go back to sleep ... Don't go back to sleep ... Don't go back to sleep."
~Rumi

"If you want revolution, be it."
~Caitlin Johnstone

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

elenacarlena's picture

Did someone say cats?? Biggrin

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Please check out Pet Vet Help, consider joining us to help pets, and follow me @ElenaCarlena on Twitter! Thank you.

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Beware the bullshit factories.

RantingRooster's picture

Lol

I came to this thread just because of your subject line!
Did someone say cats?? Biggrin

I have got to stop drinking coffee reading these threads, everywhere I tell ya, just every where...keyboard, desk clothes,,. out the nose....

I think I saw the word Kitty or kitties... and I'm like Preved kats, cats, every, I love cats, give me kats, more cats, I need cats

RR

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C99, my refuge from an insane world. #ForceTheVote

riverlover's picture

and mention of c-a-t does it every time. Wink

[edit unfortunate 2 letter typo ruined the nest one-liner]

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Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.

RantingRooster's picture

they train us to respond to "cat", like Pavlov's dogs... Wacko

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C99, my refuge from an insane world. #ForceTheVote

I really would like to know wtf happened.
I want to engage in politics. I want young people to vote.
What we saw was our lifetime candidate turn into dust. Did he prove to us, once and for all, there is just no hope?
Democracy in America is a fiction?
Although I am tired of trying to argue for or against his purity of motives, the question remains, what happened to democracy?

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"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

gulfgal98's picture

It is long, but it has Chris Hedges, Cornel West, and Richard Wolff discussing the importance of patriot Thomas Paine's writings during the Revolution. Absolutely one of the most fascinating discussions I have seen because one of the things that comes up is about the concept of democracy in the United States.

[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itvtwoVCTxM]

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

I am headed to bed, but will watch this later, and thanks for the link.

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"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

katchen's picture

we need an explanation, and young people need it most of all. I would even say that he owes that to us.

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The silence is deafening. Stoke us up, then walk away. Gives no hope. Just bad options.

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lunachickie's picture

tells me that it's a perfectly reasonable assumption to presume that pressure has been brought to bear on him such that even if he did open his mouth, no one would know about it.

If you've studied psychology at all, you know that bullies love to demoralize those victims they wish to manipulate. It makes their life as a bully a whole lot easier. I will continue to believe that Bernie Sanders pretty much demonstrated how little hope we have left, since The Bullies have taken over--even though that was the last thing he ever wanted to do. And that sucks, but the fact that we know it because of him is no reason to get all pissed off at him about it.

That's exactly where "pressure brought to bear" starts making sense to me. In that sense, you can almost hear the gloating in media, who suddenly finds it necessary to fall all over itself to report "What Bernie is Doing". They practically slobber with glee as they note, "Look how dutiful he is! If Bernie can do it, you can too. Now STFU and get in line, stupid Democrat".

They're sick. And I don't have to hang around and catch whateverthefuck is ailing them. The Democrats can go pack sand, and if Sanders plans to stump for them, oh well, good for him. Whether he's done it under duress or not, I don't have to actually listen to him and neither does anybody else.

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" the fact that we know it because of him is no reason to get all pissed off at him about it." Or " don't kill the messenger"

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

that this isn't working out the way they planned:

you can almost hear the gloating in media, who suddenly finds it necessary to fall all over itself to report "What Bernie is Doing". They practically slobber with glee as they note, "Look how dutiful he is! If Bernie can do it, you can too. Now STFU and get in line, stupid Democrat".

That's why the recent attack on millennials has stepped up. And additional pressure on Black voters, which I think is ill-advised (politically as well as morally), even coming from Obama. He may have crossed a bit of a line in trying to emotionally blackmail them.

The Clinton camp internals must be total shit.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

riverlover's picture

Yes, internals must be bad, and of course, she takes it personally but it's true, many people with varying justifications will not vote FOR her. Now it's circular, like water under Coriolis force.

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Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.

... that the more they panic and lash out, the better I feel?

The only problem is that we're all going to wake up with a four year hangover come November 9.

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elenacarlena's picture

Most likely he was pressured.

Whatever his explanation, we still need to fix the hackable voting machines and other potential sources of election fraud, get money out of politics, and address climate change and a whole array of other issues. I too now think the party is unfixable, so that means we have to vote for someone other than the main parties (I certainly don't want to see the Repugs prevail!). I don't see where "What is Bernie doing??" matters. Just ignore him. Unless Hill collapses during the debates, then we will see.

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We have the only explanations that we are going to get. And even if we get another explanation, we can still theorize that the new explanation, too, was coerced or whatever. We will never have a definitive answer that everyone accepts and no one can speculate about. We each have our own opinions and that is all we are ever going to have. Meanwhile, election day is less than two months away.

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Raggedy Ann's picture

No one person can do it for us. When Bernie threw in the towel, so did the people. They/we were in shock.

What is happening on the ground, now? If Bernie is not our "leader," who is? Is deocracy gone? If so, how did it get past me? We are all personally responsible for living in an oligarchy. We thought Bill C. brought us a big economic boom! Look at the fall-out. I happened under our watch, but we weren't watching so well.

Bush brought mass serveilance via the fear factor. Some of us protested, but fear won the day.

Obama didn't prosecute the banksters and OWS was shut down. Bernie was silenced

To me, it is up to us to keep writing and bringing awareness to our situation. We must change our Congress. We must change our state houses. We must run for office and/or support the ones we agree with, with passion. We must be the change without fail.

Ah, but I sing to the choir. Sometime rehashing will bring new ideas. I get that. Pleasantry

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"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11

working inside the system. It's just not voting Democratic.

Either he's treacherous, or he's under pressure. I don't see a third option.

This is the crux of your post, yet, other possibilities exist and a number of us see them. Even as to the primary, everyone may not see it as you and I do. Or, if they think this primary was utterly rigged, they may believe the same is true of every Democrat primary since primaries since the first one.

When it comes to motives, all anyone can do is guess to take the person solely at face value, or guess other scenarios. In either case, the guess may be right or it may be wrong, but it's still all guessing.

As I see it, what you are saying can be boiled down to: Sanders did not go Green (or indie, or other newer party) when you did. He did not draw the line when and where you did. Maybe he did not even see the primary as you saw it.) And, you are convinced that the way you saw things is the only way an honest person could possibly have seen them. Therefore, the only possible reason that Sanders would not have come out about 2016 differently than the way that you came out is terror or corruption, or both.

Based on that: "Therefore" Sanders cannot possibly have a good faith belief that voting to keep a Republican out of office, as millions of Democrats do every two years and as you and I did in the past, is the best thing he can realistically do for the country. "Therefore," Sanders is either terrified or corrupt. "Therefore," he was probably threatened. But, all the "therefores" in this paragraph rest on the premise that someone cannot possibly see things differently from you without being terrified or corrupt. I don't think that is sound. Your conclusion may be right, anyway, but, again, the correctness of a conclusion is a separate issue from the process by which one reaches a conclusion.

If Sanders had come down differently in 2016 than he has come down in the past 20 years, minimum, I personally would see a stronger basis to search for a reason for the change, be it corruption or fear or whatever. But you seem to assume there must be an extreme reason for him to have remained the same, even though you changed. Or, at least, an extreme reason for announcing a few days sooner than you expected that he would give his all to support the 2016 nominee of the Democratic Party in order to defeat the Republican nominee (same announcement he made umpteen times, from 2014 to July 12, 2016, anyway/em>).

Again, I am not saying you are wrong or right. I am looking only at how you got to your conclusions. Your conclusions could be 100% right (or 100% wrong): Anything is is possible. Sanders may have been threatened or beaten. He may have come down in the same place he has come down for 20 years because he loves the deals he has made with the Vermont Democratic Party 20 years ago and with the Senate Democratic Caucus when he ran for the Senate. He may even have come down in the same place he has come down for 20 years because he is a terrible person in some other way. I just don't see those things as the only possibilities. He could simply, honestly see things very differently than you see them. Or something in between. Or something else entirely.

As for my post about Sanders' evolution, it said nothing about Sanders' character. Showing with article after article and direct quote after direct quote that Sanders came to the same bottom line in 2016 that he has come to for at least the past 20 years is not stating any conclusion about anything. Your post did draw alternative conclusions about Sanders' character based on his not changing a 20-year pattern this time. My post, however, went out of my way to state facts without drawing any conclusions. For example:

Despite what counterpunch says, the deal with the Vermont Democratic Party could have been the cause of Bernie's seeming change of heart toward Democrats could or only correlation. I am not saying either way because I don't know either way.

Again, I mention this mostly because others have raised the issue of Bernie's deals with Democrats. I have no idea if his deals with Democrats contribute to his endorsing Democrats and I will not speculate about that point. Moreover, it may not be either-or: He could genuinely believe that supporting Democrats is the best course for the country, but he is not averse to making the best deal for himself when promising to support Democrats or to vote with the Democratic Caucus.

Near the end of a long post containing only facts, I stated:

In light of all the above, claims that Bernie was beaten and/or threatened to make him endorse Hillary seem unrealistic. On July 12, 2016 and at the 2016 Democratic National Convention near the end of July, he did what he has done and espoused since 1996 and what he repeatedly said he would do in this year. And, as I have stated in prior replies, all the above aside, men in suits are covered from their collars to the soles of their shoes. No one hired to "muscle" Bernie would have left marks on Bernie's face to fuel speculation that Hillary or the DNC had a 75 year-old progressive United States Senator beaten to get his support.

If beating seems unlikely, was Bernie threatened to do what he has preached and done since 1996? I don't know, but I doubt it. If anything, he may have made assurances and gotten agreements about his speech, the platform, his role in the convention, etc. before July 12--a negotiation.

"I don't know, but I doubt it" is the most personal opinion my long post expressed about anything (other than the foolishness of leaving marks on the face, rather than the torso or legs). That you saw my post as a statement about Bernie's character is also based only your opinion, quoted above, that there are only two possible explanations for Bernie's doing the same thing in 2016 as he has done for at least 20 years. I don't agree that there are only two and I don't agree that my post said anything whatever about Bernie's character.

BTW, I don't assume a single thing about you or your character because you not only were voting for Democrats to or through 2015, but also making it your "day job" (figure of speech). I also don't assume anything about Nader's character because he reached his limit well before you and I did. I don't even assume anything about Nader's character because Nader reached his limit well before we did, yet he now says Sanders is doing the right thing vis-à-vis Hillary 2016. I may not understand where Nader is coming from, but I don't assume anything about Nader's character simply because he is in a different place than I am (and in a different place that I thought he has been since the 1980s.)

Above all, the point of my post was that is September 19; election day is November 8. What we do between now and November 9 can be critical.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

I voted Stein last time, and voted very selectively in '14--there were a couple of MD Dems I thought still had ethics, but I didn't vote party line across the board--I left a lot of blanks on the ballot. So, yeah, my line was crossed a while ago, for reasons far less dramatic than the current ones (taxation and budget).

As for you making attacks on my character, of course I don't think you were making attacks on my character; I was making an analogy. If I thought you were making attacks on my character I wouldn't have written this essay. I don't engage in debate with people who make character attacks (although occasionally, when I can't resist doing so, I mock them, on Twitter and elsewhere--it's an inadvisable waste of time hunting trolls, but sometimes I can't resist).

You're right that I think that Bernie ought to have reached his personal Rubicon after seeing this level of election fraud, voter suppression, and dirty tricks, done so blatantly, and that NOT having reached that Rubicon after seeing the Clinton machine behave like this either means he finds those conditions bearable (line not crossed) or that his line WAS crossed, and there's an external reason why he's still giving support.

My essay can be summed up by: "Yeah, he did that stuff for 20 years, but new data has just been presented to him and to all of us, data which should produce, if not a change, at least a reaction other than `business as usual, beat the Repubs, BAD Repubs!'"

Above all, the point of my post was that is September 19; election day is November 8. What we do between now and November 9 can be critical.

Well, I'm supporting Stein, and so are a lot of people here; if your point is that my energy would have been better spent writing up an action diary on VotePact rather than responding to your essay, that point is well taken; but just as you don't agree with my method of reasoning, I didn't agree with yours. That said, I totally acknowledge that your essay contained nothing but facts; I wasn't disputing your data, but the way you draw conclusions from history, in the sense that the data doesn't really answer the question posed, IMO.

I do, however, agree wholeheartedly with this:

Most of all, does any of this much matter at this juncture? If you plan to vote for Hillary, for the love of heaven, let it be because of you and not because of Bernie. If you want to vote for those left of Democrats, great: I will walk or run in that direction with you. Either way, Bernie's motives should not be the focus: Election Day is only a month and a half away.

First, I agree about how much it matters; people psychologically NEED an explanation and deserve one, but they/we aren't going to get one, and so we must move on (to coin a phrase). Second, people should only vote Hillary if they truly want to b/c they believe she will be the best candidate. Third, voting for those to the left of the Democrats is a good choice, IMO, even if the electoral system is corrupted, because people need a place from which to fight and organize, and, at the moment, the Green Party is the best option on the table.

And yes, Election Day is only a month and a half away, but most people here--not all, but most--have already decided that they're not going to vote Hillary and that they are either going to vote for those left of the Dems, or not vote at all. Apparently, given Hillary's tanking numbers and the recent reactions of the Establishment, that's not a particularly rare reaction (though sadly, Gary Johnson appears to be reaping more benefit from this than Dr. Stein).

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

though I see your point, because the establishment has made it so.

They treat 3rd party votes as absolutely outside the system; it's been the work of some 40 years to get us from John Anderson being on the stage w/Reagan and Carter to the current system, where 3rd party candidates are excluded at every level.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Either that, or I have no clue which "system" you are referring to.

Perhaps you are equating simply not supporting one of the two political candidate the establishment would prefer you to support as working outside the system, or equating "working outside the system," with doing something perfectly legal but different from what the majority does. If so, that is not only a misuse of the term "outside the system", but a startling misuse.

In the U.S. political system, since its inception, people who qualified under Article II of the Constitution to run for President (and possibly some who did not qualify) and wanted to run for President, have run for President. Some of them made it; some of them came close; some of them finished way, way behind the winner; some of them became laughingstocks and some of them, we've never heard of because their run did make a ripple. No newer Party candidate has won since Lincoln, but that does not mean that voting Republican then was working outside "the system."

Doing something different from the majority is not working outside the US political system. Disobeying the law is working outside the US political system. Peacefully and lawfully protesting a war is not working outside the system; putting a bomb in a Pentagon john to protest a war is working outside the system. Making abolitionist speeches is not working outside the system; helping slaves escape to Canada or to a free territory, rather than helping their "owner" regain them, as the law requires is working outside the system.

Singing We Shall Overcome or marching with a permit is not working outside the system; sitting at a lunch counter the laws of your state say you may not legally sit at is working outside the system; running for President as the Constitution and other laws enable you to do is not working outside "the system," as I understand the term.

Until relatively recently, you and I did what a majority of Americans legally do, voting for the candidate of a large political party. Now, we want to do what a minority of Americans have been doing for centuries, namely, voting for the candidate of a smaller and newer party. Neither of those things, however, is working outside the U.S. system of laws, courts, prisons, etc.

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elenacarlena's picture

you seem to ignore the reasons why so many of us are now fed up: Namely, the vote hacking, voter disenfranchisement, and other means the DNC used to put their thumb on the scales for Hill. As pissed off as that makes us, we aren't the ones who exhausted ourselves running a national campaign, traveling the country, so it certainly seems to us that Bern should be even more pissed off than we are.

That's why Bernie doing what he has done for the last 20 years seems so odd. Because he should be our next President. That opportunity has been stolen from him, and it's unlikely he'll have a better opportunity in the future. I've voted mostly Democratic for the last almost 40 years. But the situation has changed and now I'll be voting Green. Why is Bernie reacting to a changed situation with the same behavior?

I know, no answer to that question is possible. But I think this explains why Bernie doing the same thing as always makes us all wonder what is wrong with him.

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I could as easily say that you are ignoring everything I've posted and everything Bernie himself and his wife has said and done for 20 years, right up to and including the Democratic Convention, but that is not the kind of thing I normally say.

As for the primary, I said on this thread, in my first reply to CSTS:

"Either he's treacherous, or he's under pressure. I don't see a third option." This is the crux of your post, yet, other possibilities exist and a number of us see them. Even as to the primary, everyone may not see it as you and I do. Or, if they think this primary was utterly rigged, they may believe the same is true of every Democrat primary since primaries since the first one.

But the only view of the primary that matters is that of Bernie Sanders, not mine or yours. On threads other than this one, I have pointed out that Bernie that the primary was not crooked, it was just dumb, and that Jane Sanders later said that Hillary clearly won--the numbers were just too large. She went on to say that, if they (she and her husband) thought they'd won, they would have contested it."
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/bernie-sanders-democratic-primary-not-rigged...

Also http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/04/13/jane-sanders-we-would-v... (April 2016-Jane Sanders: Bernie and I Will Vote Hillary if We Have To)

(Mind you, I don't agree with either of them, but it's Bernie's thoughts and actions, not mine, that this board has been discussing for months. His words have matched his actions. Could he be both lying and dissembling? Sure. I can't know which, though, and neither can anyone else on this board..

Bernie could have seen the primary as CSTS saw it and still believe helping to defeat Trump is the best thing he can realistically do for Americans and other people of the planet.* Or, at least a score of other possibilities that have nothing to do with Bernie's having been threatened or bribed. Or maybe Bernie was threatened or bribed.

Bernie never says Hillary is a great candidate, just as he never said her husband was a great candidate. He always takes the lesser of "two" evils position, often expressly. Also, at the convention, when speaking to his supporters who were booing what he said, he responded, "Brothers and sisters, this is the world we live in." If this is a man whose family has been threatened, he could do a lot better than that.

Maybe all the above sounds to you like he was threatened and you could be right. However, another possibility is that someone is doing the best thing he sees as a realistic possibility under the circumstances, just like he's done for 20 years and just like I and millions of leftists have done every two years. And I, too, could be right. And that is only one event and one statements out of thousands that you and I might interpret differently.

Again, there is this assumption that hat Bernie, who has been in politics, losing and winning, all of his adult life, and has probably seen a lot of dirt up close than any of us, just has to draw a line in the sand when you, CSTS and I did. If he doesn't, the only reasonable conclusion is that he is terrified or corrupt. I think other conclusions are possible.

That I see more possibilities than you and CSTS does not equate to my ignoring anything. It also does not equate to my being right and your being wrong or to your being right and my being wrong.

As for the rest, http://caucus99percent.com/comment/178692#comment-178692

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Hawkfish's picture

Moral values are not the same and in the real world they sometimes they conflict and we have to choose. I think that he really does believe that Trump is dangerous and this overrides the part of the moral compass that you and he share.

At least that is my guess.

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We can’t save the world by playing by the rules, because the rules have to be changed.
- Greta Thunberg

MsDidi's picture

Brilliant essay and much needed. Every time someone argues that we should have known that Bernie would collapse because he said he would support the winner of the Democratic primary I feel like I've been sucker-punched again.

I am in Bernie's generation, have gone through many of the same phases as he has and as you describe, but I can find no reasonable explanation from our joint and collective history that explains his behavior in an honorable way (short of being disabled by threats, in which case he is likely disabled for the long run as well).

After Obama was elected and started trying to fashion a Grand Bargain based on Republican tax reform proposals, I attended a local MoveOn meeting (something I did rarely following its unquestioning support of his campaign.) The organization had said it wanted to know from the grass roots what priorities we wanted to follow. I went to the meeting with great frustration about the Obama sellout that had already begun, thinking there would be at least some other like-minded folks in attendance. When I asserted that tax reform is a Republican formula, I was shouted down. The response was that we had to support Obama and that the tax reform package offered him a quick 'victory' ???. There didn't seem even to be any understanding of why tax reform can't be the basis of a leftward movement, no matter how opportunistically they might be in looking for a quick 'win.' I raise this example to confirm your point of crossing lines.

I had worked for many years as a member of the Democratic Party and had worked to elect Bill Clinton twice. Have worked on many local campaigns and committees for selected candidates. When I didn't know all the candidates, I just pulled the lever for the Dem. But when Obama was elected I felt that a sea-change had occurred. Much of my previous work had been in directly organizing minority communities in urban areas. I think the reason the birther myth got legs is because Obama has no clear roots in the Black community here - literally or figuratively. He was always the favorite son of the powers we now refer to as the 1% (not accidental that Occupy occurred during his presidency). I kept saying at the time that Obama had none of the instincts of someone who grew up in urban areas or whose cousins and uncles had experienced the kinds of oppression that people in the 'hood experience everyday.

For me it was always a wonderment that it was always a stretch to think of Obama as having cousins and uncles -- where are they? I kept asking people who they thought his grandmother was. Not because I thought he was born in some other country, but because grandmothers have always been important to the Black identity -- as shapers of clear lines and principled struggle. Obama was never "of the people" in the way Jesse was. (Soon after, in his mercurial rise to power based on Wall Street support, Obama brutally insulted Jesse, as if to prove my point.)

I knew that once Obama was elected leftward criticism would be silenced completely. Some of my most left-leaning friends argued that we couldn't criticize a Black president because we would effectively be supporting racist arguments -- this in spite of the fact that he received more money from Wall Street than any other candidate up to that time. All criticism was verboten.
This is the reason for drawing the clear lines that you argue for. If politics is not principled, and if one cannot criticize someone who is female or Black or Hispanic -- no matter how much they threaten progressive policies and people -- then there is no reason to be in progressive politics at all.

It's because Bernie and I lived through the same histories that I choke when trying to explain what he's done. I know he knows better. We all know better. But it's not because of wanting to villify someone who lit a prairie fire -- it's because of the tremendous sadness and cynicism it creates in a newly awakened generation. Those who have come to the conclusion that they may as well support Trump and who perhaps have not yet struggled enough on the front lines to understand why that can't be a reasonable choice. The young paid staff in Bernie offices who didn't even want to know how the local Dem electoral machines worked, nor to learn of what obstacles they would encounter on election day.

Over all these years what I have come firmly to believe is that a struggle must proceed on clear principles in order to be successful. Unity can't be forged on personality, on Rock-Star-ism, on the lesser of two evils, or on adopting Republican programs because it's the only way our "hero-leaders" can get a win.

I agree that a line was crossed in this primary season for all the reasons you have so eloquently listed. To people who think this is rehashing unnecessarily, I say that we have to understand what happened in order not to repeat it and also in order to develop a clear set of guiding, bedrock principles for moving forward.

It's just not okay to say that we should have expected this from Bernie. Every ounce of my own moral fiber says this smells very bad -- what got us here in the first place is hero worship( including both Bill Clinton & Obama-ism in that), and with facing so many elections cast as a choice between the lesser of two evils. How many times have you been told to just hold your nose and vote for a Dem. who doesn't clearly reflect the will of the people?

Think of how Hillary would fare against anyone more principled than Trump. If the Dems wanted a coronation of their deeply disliked & distrusted figure, they needed an opponent like Trump in order to be able to advance the lesser of two evils argument. Maybe he's just a Clinton deal (a la the airplane summit with Lynch) that went bad -- the monster turned on the Frankenstein who created him -- and now they are having trouble finding a wooden stake big enough to silence him.

Thank you for your ever clear arguments and energy around building a coalition based on principles, reasoned debate and refusal to accept what happened as something that we should have expected all along -- certainly not from a strong and vigorous leader who argued tirelessly for a politics based on issues & principles.

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mhagle's picture

You said it.

Thank you for your ever clear arguments and energy around building a coalition based on principles, reasoned debate and refusal to accept what happened as something that we should have expected all along -- certainly not from a strong and vigorous leader who argued tirelessly for a politics based on issues & principles.

I think I read enough and listen enough to have a grasp of the facts that we know (much is unknown). My conclusions however, are based on impressions and feelings. I watched many speeches and heard Bernie Sanders in person. I felt the passion, compassion, and really desperate need to see change and justice for all people. It was so tangible you could reach out and touch it.

That's still there for me. I have never watched any of the endorsing Hillary speeches. I carry that passion into my support for Jill Stein and Ajamu Baraka. They are only a slightly different flavor of the same ice cream. Their ideals are my ideals and are Bernie Sander's ideals.

I personally believe they threatened his family. Like a mom protecting her kid - I remember what rose up in me the first time someone said something negative about my baby, and the lengths I have gone to, to continue to protect them. All of you with kids know what I am talking about. You do what you have to do.

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Marilyn

"Make dirt, not war." eyo

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

In my opinion, we are all living in Harlan County now. And it's hard to process the feelings around Bernie and move forward.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

riverlover's picture

the only clear route. I have lost a spouse to death, Many of you have not, you may not even have lost a parent. Spouse loss, that is a sea-change. Picking up all the ceded responsibilities. Continuing to live. Experiencing pity (not helpful) or passive rejection (also not helpful, but eye-opening).

So we must move forward. Bernie managed a coalescence. He left much very vague. Sharpening the tip of the arrowhead causes flakes of flint to fall away, lost parts. So how to continue without losing support from groups that can splinter off, single-issue stuff? For instance, guns. I just stay away.

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which I posted, did not reach one conclusion or another. Plenty of commentary on this board states flatly that the ONLY possible interpretation of events is that Bernie was beaten, as evidenced by a mark on his cheek (to me, the least plausible scenario) or that he was bribed. I don't think those are the only two possibilities. In fact, I very much doubt the beating is even a possibility. However, I did not reach any conclusion.

Then I have no clue which "system" you are referring to.

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Kurt from CMH's picture

the election of Trump as President needs to be stopped at all costs. That's why he is supporting Hillary, like it or not. I don't question his integrity; Sen. Sanders is just being pragmatic.

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For at least another hundred years we must pretend to ourselves and to everyone that fair is foul and foul is fair; for foul is useful and fair is not. Avarice and usury and precaution must be our gods for a little longer still.
John Maynard Keynes, 1930

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

to stop Trump, as recent polls have shown.

Bernie knew the numbers as well as everybody else did. By uniting with Stein and walking out of the Democratic party, he would have thrashed Trump. Independents and millennials would have rallied behind him and we'd all be excited right now at his prospects.

Hillary is the worst possible way to beat Trump--just as Trump is the worst possible way to beat Hillary.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

TheOtherMaven's picture

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There is no justice. There can be no peace.

shaharazade's picture

up thread " not to put my eggs in a personality basket to make my political goals happen." I learned that lesson well from swallowing the bait and then getting switched by Obama's campaign. I did get my eyes opened and my head cleared when then Senator Obama voted for FISA. With Bernie I didn't make it through the primary he lost me with his Liberty U speach when he said the the Saudis should start doing their part in the killing grounds of the ME. I also thought he was way to 'nice' to the Mad Bomber and did not really stand up to her on the issues. Incrementalism is a myth, a lie.

Loved his stump speech but then again Obama's were great too. I did give a damn about her e-mails and also kept thinking why does he caucus with these corrupt war criminals anyway. Amendments to bad fundamentally anti-democratic legislation does not cut it and neither does symbolic filibusters. What really pissed me off was his claims that she won fair and square when even the non liberal Stanford University report said it was rigged. It's not just Bernie that gets my ire up about the Democratic so called progressives in congress the progressive and black caucuses both fold like cheap tents and all endorsed and kissed the Clinton's ring.

Now that he's running around stumping for her and lecturing young ones about 'protest votes', he can kiss my ass. So is lying about the party platform and Killary and saying he was in it to win another example of his touted integrity? The politics of persona and identity politics defeat the purpose of democratic representatives. I think Bernie's intent or motivation or even his betrayal is not important. What's important is 43+ million people turned out and supported taking on the oligarchical collectivist who own and run this country.

As my precinct boss at Obama's Oregon campaign headquarters said when I called to quit Obama's campaign the day after his FISA vote, remember Obama's not what's important what counts is the movement that's out there working for change. This was not Bernie's movement, it's been a long time in the making and he gave it a voice in the electoral system. The people who supported him already knew what was going down. It's not going anywhere because it's of and by people not Bernie, the DNC or even the phony corrupt Democratic pols on all levels who run as progressives.

Why spend all this time and energy pissing and moaning and grieving about Bernie? So what if he was sheep-dogging the liberals it did not work. It did not work because the people who flocked to his campaign are not stupid. Nobody but the really brainwashed, fear riddled and greedy think that Hillary or the whole party is anything but what it is, rotten and anti-democratic to the core. It's going to get worse, count on it, and people of good spirit need to figure out how to form coalitions and learn to develop solidarity with all the 99% globally. Focusing on pols, persona and shenanigans of the courtiers and the propagandist's is not going to put this humpty together again.

Take what you have gathered from coincidence

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Aardvark's picture

when the political party to which he or she belongs is based on a well-articulated set of consistent rules. Certain actions and policies are entailed in these rules, and others are not. It is not always so cut-and-dry, but even where there is disagreement, the reasons for disagreement are much more clear than the spin-doctored jello salad that is "democracy."

Peace and love be with you, reader.

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riverlover's picture

Tiny grapes and marshmallows that had to coexist suspended in flavored gelatin. I like it (the analogy, not the salad).

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Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.

pswaterspirit's picture

His role was to bring people together and get them talking. He convinced many through positive encouragement that they can make a difference.

In February of 2015 it was uncovered that the port commission of a nearby city had been secretly negotiating with Tesoro / Savage to build the largest oil transfer facility in the world right on the Columbia river in Washington State. It was considered a done deal by both the oil company and the port. Many of us swallowed this bitter pill firmly believing that there was nothing we could do.

Bernie came to town in May. He stood on the stage and told everybody that if we got together we could change the world. I am someone who played a large role in marajuana legalization in this state so I knew all this but Bernie was needed to remind me. Others entertained the idea for the first time.

Earlier that day in Seattle the day of the BLM take over of the stage the grandmother's of one of the Northwest tribes met with Bernie in what they considered a hopeless cause over a second oil port in Bellingham, WA. I knew about this because I am also Northwest Indian. One of the ladies was my aunt.

After this meeting this group of 5 80 somethings traveled the coast in an old Mini van convincing others to join the fight

The port commission meeting in Vancouver drew 300 people just like me who had come to the conclusion someone had to stand up and say something. The meeting was slated for a room that held 85. The commission was so freaked out they canceled the meeting. A week later they held the meeting in an auditorium to an overflow crowd of over 1000 people who opposed the oil port.

The Lummi Nation took the wheel shortly after that joined by the Quinalt, Warm Springs, Quiliute and Nisqually nations. Together with our neighbors including such divergent groups as the union members of the local paper mill and professors from the universities we have rallied around a special totem pole and have managed victory after victory over big oil

While we await the final call on the last living proposal for an oil port the Totem pole and our top advisors are in standing rock camp because the moccasin telegraph is a real thing and much faster with internet. Victories here got people there to stand up and be heard.

Bernie is a rock thrower. He throws a rock into the water to create ripples we are those ripples. He is no more or less important than any one of the thousands of people Now or in the future who will add something to this battle. He is no more important than the grandmothers who tossed the rocks that have brought the indigenous nations of the western hemisphere out to fight united for the first time in history.

We all have an opinion on where this should go but in the end it will go where it does and we will adjust our fight accordingly. Electing Bernie and like minded people to Congress and the Senate was the easy trail. As a nation we were foolish enough not to take that one. Now we must try to decide which rock wall we will be climbing to get there.

My informal survey of fellow Indians says the red vote may favor Jill Stein by a good margin. We uniformly agree we will continue to respect Bernies rock throwing arm and give careful attention and consideration to what he may decide to toss out in the futute.

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GeorgeJohn's picture

I was mostly hanging out with my friends Stoli and Campari in order to make it from the end of the DemConv to Election Night.....

Brilliant piece.

George

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