Open Planning Conference Tomorrow
Submitted by PriceRip on Wed, 06/08/2016 - 3:47pm
Drop in and add to the list:
State as succulently as possible what we want to do and what we hope to accomplish. Do not evaluate, just add suggestions.
This list is only to get you started. Please add to this list in the comments.
- What are we suggesting
- #ReRegistrationDay
- #MigrationDay
- #ExitLeft
- What do we want to accomplish:
- Divest from the Democratic Party
- Form a new Party
Tomorrow I will then construct a poll so we can all see what seems viable within c99p. The voting pattern should be such that you vote for multiple items but please go through the process only once. Setting the poll to avoid multiple passes is resource intensive and I do not want to slow the system to a crawl. So vote for as many items as you would like but please do so only once.
I thank you for your participation.
Robert I. Price
Comments
OK.
#global connections
Now, off to puppy training
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
I really am very concerned that if primary voters leave the
Dem party before the convention, the Dem establishment will somehow use that to deny Bern the power that he currently plans to bring to the convention.
OTOH, some have said that if there is a mass exit from the party before the convention, that will put the fear into the party that they will lose in November, so they will be more receptive to Bernie's agenda, not less.
Not sure how to phrase this, but is this something we can discuss in your planning conference? Thanks!
Please check out Pet Vet Help, consider joining us to help pets, and follow me @ElenaCarlena on Twitter! Thank you.
Why can't we leave
right after the convention? I think it would accomplish the same thing.
I'd like to add
-boycott the 2016 Presidential Election between Trump and Clinton with the goal of changing the political system so we don't have to put up with this shit anymore and possibly prevent either of them from becoming President.
Before people shoot it down with the obligatory partisan rejection as being something no one would notice, the point would be to make them notice. And I think the re-registration day thing is basically a boycott anyway of the dem party.
The boycott could entail not voting at all and/or voting for third party (like Stein) but the point would be to specifically boycott/protest Trump and Clinton. I won't vote for Stein, I know a lot of people who won't vote for Stein (or either of the two crazies) so a broader boycott could include a lot more people than just those willing to sign up with the Greens or form a new party.
I won't be around tomorrow so that's all I can add for now.
You should still vote
especially if you live in a state in which the Green Party is on the ballot.
Not voting is what they want.
Just my dumb opinion.
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott
Man, no offense but I don't know how much more of that
I can take. Talking to people here who most have voted dem all their lives, been very active in the electoral process, etc., is a lot different than talking to some of the people I run with.
Like I ask people when they come back at me with that, what If I voted for Trump, is that better than not voting at all? Or even Clinton?
You see the thing is Steven, I'm 60, I have a solid background I won't get into here and I did vote for Stein in 2012 after voting for Obama in 2008. It's not like I haven't put a great deal of thought into this.
I've evolved to the point where I am rejecting the national representative system of 535 politicians supposedly representing 330 million people. Not only that, I no longer support having a single person as "President". I am for creating a new political system and rejecting the current one and don't believe that can be done by participating in the current one, especially now with Trump vs. Clinton. In fact, I think that gives us an opportunity to reject it.
That doesn't fit here clearly, so from what I'm seeing, I'm probably going to chase the shadows soon. I was waiting to see what happened to Bernie before I decided.
And no, it's not a dumb opinion, it's a common and valid opinion.
Well I agree we need a reboot on our so-called
democracy.
Personally I favor proportional voting where legislative seats are assigned not based on winner take all, but on total votes cast for each candidate for Congress. In a state with 10 reps, say, where 40% vote R, 30% vote D and 30% a third party (let's call it the "Indies" for now) you would have 4 republican congress critters, 3 Dems and 3 Indies. There are other ways to do proportional voting systems, of course, that's just one idea.
And kill off the Electoral College. Whoever winds up with the most votes for President wins, period. Make every vote count, not only the votes in just a few swing states.
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott
You and I do not always agree on tactics.
But on this . . .
. . . you are wrong. All views have a place here, and yours, as much as they may differ from the majority consensus, merit just as much respectful consideration as anyone else's. Please stick around; I always find nuggets of wisdom in the posts of yours that I most disagree with.
Thanks dym
I'm not suggesting I'll leave, I owe too much to JtC and respect him too much to want to split now. I just have to follow my conscience and my goals wherever that might lead. We all have to keep fighting for what we think is right. There's no other way.
Please reconsider "chasing the shadows".
I would like to add my voice to Dance You Monster's in asking you to stick around. I am curious about your thoughts on an alternative system to the one that is now failing us. Ben Franklin warned us when he said, "A republic, if you can keep it." We are now at the place where we may not be able to keep it. Your Smedley Butler quotation also appeals to me because I have read most of what he wrote and am familiar with his life story. We are reliving his experience, as you know.
Would it be possible for you to write an essay on your current thoughts on an alternative political system and publish it here? I can guarantee I will read it and comment. Now that Bernie's campaign as a full time job is ending, we will have time to discuss other subjects besides the Democratic Party and its criminal owners. I have a couple of non-campaign subjects in mind as well.
By the way, I registered Green when Bill Clinton first ran and have been independent ever since until my strategic registration as a Dem this time. I suspect there are more people like me here than we know. I'm tired of Daily Kos and good democrats too. Think about writing an essay on your subject and on your terms.
-Greed is not a virtue.
-Socialism: the radical idea of sharing.
-Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.
John F. Kennedy, In a speech at the White House, 1962
I am certain there are:
I will be doing that. Like I said, I've been waiting for
this Bernie thing to shake out to see where we're at. It's become more clear but not totally. Probably soon so I'll give it a shot.
I have never been fond of the throw out the baby
with the bathwater approach, and I am still not. While I agree with a lot of what you say, I find a few problems.
First, an alternative approach to what you are suggesting is to just boycott the presidential race. There are races down ballot that cannot be ignored. More in a bit. My suggestion is to get maximum participation in November with minimum (preferably none) voting for either Clinton or Trump.
Second, here is why I cannot agree with a complete boycott. It is that down ballot vote. There are good people--progressives--that are needed to replace the establishment, and there are some already there who need to be protected. Would you throw Tulsi Gabbard (or pick someone you do like) to the wolves? Would you rather keep DWS or would you prefer Tim Canova?
We the People need a rear guard while we effect changes. The current progressives and those we can get elected will provide that. One of the best strategies for getting things done is to have someone on the inside.
Third, you want to rebuild a democracy from the ground up. Unless you plan to seriously bring out the pitchforks and torches--keeping in mind all the time that they have the tanks--do you think the establishment is going to just roll over and say okay, go for it?
There are still parts of our current Constitution and institutions that still work. Should we throw those away or should we revise them for a modern society? We need that infrastructure to help us educate and incorporate those of the 99% who are going to fight against the changes. People most often fear change more than they fear Clinton or Trump or the current government system. Cf the recent primary season.
While some of your ideas some times strike me as a bit off key, you do make me think of alternatives. Keep them coming.
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
Someone asked
Someone who does not care for Trump or Clinton asked for my opinion. This was my reply. Do vote for the down ticket candidates but not for president; that sends a clear message.
It's simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves that we've been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back. Carl Sagan
Don't vote lesser of two evils, but
Vote Green: Jill Stein (My choice)
Vote Independent: (whoever is running)
Vote Libertarian: Gary Johnson (Not a choice of mine at all, but that's just me, preferable to vote for him over no one)
Vote: Write-in ...Bernie
Don't compromise your values, but vote. Even if you write in your own name, don't leave it blank!
When I was a kid, Republicans used to red scare people, now it's the Democrats. I am getting too damn old for this crap!
See my reply above.
Voting in this system IS compromising my values.
I would remind people this is an OPEN planning conference where ideas, whatever their merit, should be placed in the bin for discussion. Hopefully we can have honest, non-biased discussions about this and other things.
We need to extend ourselves, remove our assumptions and consider all options we can think of imo.
Not voting lets the 1% win
They just have to corral fewer sheeple to get their puppet in.
That's why I believe we all need to vote, and like I said NOT for the lesser of two evils .
3rd party,write-in,whatever, just show you contempt for the top 2 and vote
When I was a kid, Republicans used to red scare people, now it's the Democrats. I am getting too damn old for this crap!
Well you know,
voting lets the 1% win. Just look at what's happening at the Presidential level. Who's winning?
So there we have it, two different opinions. Which one is right? I think I'm right and I'm sure you think you're right.
After my mother died, many years ago,
I started writing in her maiden name in races where I didn't like either candidate. But I've never done that on a presidential election.
The Libertarians are everywhere, the Greens are not. But a write in vote does have a certain charm.
Life is strong. I'm weak, but Life is strong.
Why won't you vote for Stein? Seems like the perfect
protest vote.
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I think there are different goals relative to voting for Stein
or third party vs. boycotting the presidential election. Voting for Stein isn't going to stop Trump or Clinton from becoming President. I'm not saying a boycott would, but it has more potential for radical change than simply voting for Stein. Additionally, voting for Stein is participating in the system whereas a boycott is rejecting the system. Like I said above, I voted for Stein in 2012 and all it got me was Clinton vs. Trump. Voting for Stein in 2016 will still get you Trump or Clinton for President.
How is boycotting going to help? Something like 67% of
the electorate didn't vote in 2014. I used that to show how we needed to move to the left. But here we are. It didn't work. Wouldn't a boycott be 2014 all over again?
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Down ballot candidates and issues
Local elections are always a reason to vote regardless of the bozos at the top of the ticket
hmmm...
#GoodbyeYellowDogRoad
#PartysOver
#DemsOverAndOut
#ByeDebbie
#LaterBlue
Imagine the creation of a viable online party
Viable online currencies have been created, after all.
Just thinking out loud.
Gëzuar!!
from a reasonably stable genius.
Take the Berners and form a new party
ready to run a candidate in 2020.
Every week
until the convention, have one action or a repeat of a previous action.
There has been voter suppression....fraud...etc. That is not acceptable to a patriotic American. So.....target one person responsible. We can vote on it. Perhaps fund the campaign of a replacement. Perhaps the action of the week would be to send that person $1.
#$1 to X
The Democratic Party has been revealed to be corrupt. What can we do that would make a difference?
Identify key superdelegates. Let them know we intent to #no vote for Hillary
as well as #no vote for superdelegate X (if they currently hold office)
MSM lies, obfuscates, propagandizes. #don't watch (read, listen) to X
Instead, #watch Y
I will be listening to Bernie
for my next move. He has the floor, he deserves it, he accomplished something historical in the socialist tradition of America, equal to Debs POTUS run in 1920 while in prison.
Defeating Trump is not the long term solution. It's a quick fix but others of his ilk will take his place in the future. Voting for Hillary is not going to work for me, and probably most of the c99%. However I suspect Bernie will be speak to us in a subtle if not coded message.
I'm bailing out of the Dem Party permanently. I will not vote for either of the two opponents.
I suspect a 3rd party vote will work against Hillary, which is the best thing I can expect. Green is the only logical choice for me. IMHO abstaining from voting will also hurt Hillary more than Trump, which is also fine with me.
The best thing I can hope for is to see Hillary lose the general election.
The most important duty I want to be involved in, is to be a part of ElectionIntegrityUSA.net to insure the will of the majority .
It's too late to sign up as an exit poll volunteer for Nov. 2016. However I let them know that I am interested in working on their behalf.
#ExitLeft day after Democratic convention
That's my preference. Personally. I need a new home. We have a WFP here in the Hartford,CT area. I'm waiting to see / hear what Birdie suggests going forward.
Don't believe everything you think.
Donor list
Today I responded to a request for another donation to Bernie. Did one last week, and can't go agian for another couple weeks. I did reply though to ask that a donor list not be shared by Bernie, and that doing so would undermine the trust we hold for his character and integrity. My donations have been for him, and him only. His platform must be embraced by any who wish to benefit from his umbrella over progressive idealism.
#NonElectoralPolitics
What this means:
The Sanders campaign, currently the largest and best organized group on the American left, could put aside elections for the time being and use its resources to build bridges between everyone else: Black Lives Matter, Fight for 15, 350.org, etc. etc. Not to create yet another organization, but to help all the non-electoral groups talk to one another, then step aside and see what happens.
Yes, I know that doesn't seem too popular these days, but it has been largely neglected with I think predictable results. Last year when it was rumored that Sanders was looking at a run, my first thought was that you can't successfully take on the oligarchy without an organized base in place first. That means large numbers of people in day-to-day personal contact, learning to work together and build oppositional institutions that can grow and start chipping away at the .01%'s control of everything. This takes a lot of the teeth out of their ability to dominate and manipulate what ordinary people know about each other and the world (among other things).
Very unlikely to happen, but there ya go. We need infrastructure for the long haul.
What I want Bernie/Bernites to accomplish at Dem convention
After this Primary season
am ready to leave the Dem party that I've been with since McGovern - something I'd never considered having believed the "not voting lets the other guy win" mindset. Having watched the depth of corruption and the blatant antics of corporate control of our society and its governance, I feel that staying in this party and voting in this presidential election at all is an endorsement of the corruption. I don't want to participate in it, though I intend to stay in the party until Bernie is no longer working as a representative on the party. Am going independent FWIW as soon as he suspends his campaign and hope that we organize a mass migration at that time. I firmly believe that we need to a big redesign of the voting process and hope that along with stating what do we want to accomplish in our divestment of/from the Democratic party that we stress a need to endorse the need for a better, more representative system.
"So it goes."
Kurt Vonnegut