Aside from Trump, Which Candidate is the Best Liar?

We all pretty much agree, I think, that Trump is one of the best liars on the political stage there is right now, maybe ever.

But who, among the democratic candidates, is most adept at lying?

Biden? His problem is that he believes in the centrist tripe he's peddling.

Also, when Bernie recently transferred some money from a previous campaign at the end of the second quarter of his campaign, none of it dark or corporate money, the MSM did not include that in their reporting of his total. But when Elizabeth Warren transferred all sorts of money she pledged not to raise during her first quarter way back when, nobody made a stink about it 'til now.

Thanks Niko.

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detroitmechworks's picture

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9 users have voted.

I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

ggersh's picture

Mayor Pete, he who knows it all nothing

I'll second that motion

"And I begin to realize that in every chapter of Shortest Way Home—indeed, almost on every page—there is an expression of the same underlying idea, which is that you can substitute experience with problem-solving skills, and approximate perspective, ideology, even morality with sheer intelligence and boldness.

This closely resembles the arrogance of tech billionaires who believe that although they have neither the knowledge nor the experience nor the wisdom, they can solve the world’s problems anyway, because, well, because look how successful they’ve been at everything else.

You almost want to cheer them on. Until you realize that they are dead wrong, that if they want to help solve the world’s problems they had better stop sucking all the oxygen and money out of the room and start paying taxes and letting there be a return to a balance of power."

Dan Simon, Mayor Pete’s autobiography says it all

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11 users have voted.

trump amerika's last president

Caitlin Johnstone

Anyone who's sure they know what humanity is and where we're headed is suffering from a psilocybin deficiency.

Alligator Ed's picture

@ggersh

"And I begin to realize that in every chapter of Shortest Way Home—indeed, almost on every page—there is an expression of the same underlying idea, which is that you can substitute experience with problem-solving skills, and approximate perspective, ideology, even morality with sheer intelligence and boldness.

This closely resembles the arrogance of tech billionaires who believe that although they have neither the knowledge nor the experience nor the wisdom, they can solve the world’s problems anyway, because, well, because look how successful they’ve been at everything else.

Pearl one: I am reminded of Eric Smellwell's (note to newbies at c99 Smellwell = Swalwell): "I will be bold without the Bold" Amen, Bro. I am not hopping on your train to nowhere--olh, looks like you jumped off just before the bridge (debate numero dos)

Pearl two: illustrates a fallacy of hasn't hurt me yet attitude confirmed by successful repetition of a stupid action. In the prime case, which inspires this statement: the self-confirming idea that seatbelts are unnecessary because I've never needed them before. Every time one takes a ride without seatbelts applied, one is taking a risk which is totally unnecessary. 6 seconds to fasten a seat-belt vs. a year in the hospital or death. Risk-benefit ratio? I wouldn't know how to calculate.

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Alligator Ed's picture

Amongst current Demonratic candidates, the question is posed: "Who is the best liar?"

Now, this question, so phrased, is ambiguous, but which nevertheless elicits an answer. By best liar, does one mean most prolific liar? Does one imply most believable lies? Does one mean greatest lie?

Having asked the question, dear sir, I shall attempt to answer it in view of my own definition of your question: The best liar in terms of consistency, chronicity--but not believability--is Hillary Goddam Klinton. I have skin in the game on this one: she will descend from the ceiling, Deus ex Machina to save the Demonratic Partei.

As far as most believable lies, the epitome being Barry Obomber, the next might be (gasp) Bernie. The lie here is implicit, not explicit. He says the correct things. He has the talked the talk. He has walked the walk. No lie there. The lie is the implicit belief that he will be either able OR willing to fulfill his grand ideas with action, should he on the million-to-one shot he becomes Dem nominee.

So, Mr. Interlocutor, I leave you with a remembrance of better days*

*Better days for whom, you might ask? Sorry. Crystal ball broken, sent out for repairs.

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Wally's picture

@Alligator Ed

It provides the context.

I was referencing this election but should have made it clearer in writing. Mea culpa.

Then there's Bernie's new slogan. . . . Not me. Us.

It's not just up to Bernie to get things done.

Any kind of effective change movement is gonna hafta involve a critical mass of activists, not just #metooism.

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Shahryar's picture

@Wally

I'm going to take the question generally as who is the biggest liar....because Trump isn't the best liar, he's just the biggest and doesn't even care when he gets caught because his true believers are too stupid to understand he's lying. Even when they know he's lying they like it.

On the Dem side I'd say Biden is the biggest liar. That whole working with segregationists to prevent school busing proving that he's been for civil rights all his life is a majestic whopper. Warren's "Native American lineage" is just ignorance. Biden's the #1 liar, I think, followed by Harris.

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Alligator Ed's picture

@Shahryar

Trump isn't the best liar, he's just the biggest and doesn't even care when he gets caught because his true believers are too stupid to understand he's lying. Even when they know he's lying they like it.

This formulation is too unkind. Many fervent Trumpites are ignorant. Many fervant Trumpites do understand he is lying. Of those who do understand, some do not agree fervently in Trump but are just flipping a giant bird at TPTB.

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Wally's picture

@Shahryar

I think Trump is the biggest liar ala Goebbels's "big lie" premise:

“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”

I also think Trump is the best in terms of results. He's in the White House having never won a political office in his life. Just a showman, a used car or snake oil salesman. Buy my steaks, which are the best, or you're denying yourself one of life's real pleasures.

Otherwise, I agree with Niko in the video. Yea, it's long. And his presentation isn't the best and it's sometimes annoying. But I think he hits the nail on the head this time around whereas other media folks just completely or purposely ignore it.

Warren is presenting herself as Bernie lite. I stopped believing anything she said last year when she endorsed Hillary. And now with her voting not only for Trump's increased military budgets, but to increase them? And she's going to throw some anti-war talk into her spiel? If she pulls it off and gets the nomination, she'll definitely prove herself to be the best liar for the Dems.

The proof will be in the pudding. And the thought just popped into my brain that the warble in Warren's voice is reminiscent of Julia Child, the TV cook from years back. That won't prove to be advantageous for her on the stage against Trump.

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lie, mislead, distort and dissemble, or conveniently get stupid suddenly when they feel they need to, including on FP, religion, and murky matters like their funding. They have to to get elected, even to the most minor office.

I rouse myself for the big whoppers only. This funding matter doesn't strike me as a biggie, even if true. I might glance at the report the p-caster cites, but it was entirely unclear (from the small portion I managed to listen to) what report he was referencing. And there is nothing in his YT notes about the report.

Warren is certainly not Hillary 2.0. I see her as a midway point on the issues between Bernie and HRC. She definitely has more credibility than Hillary, more favorable sentiment too. Sure, she has borrowed some of Bernie's plans. And maybe at the next debate one of the hopefuls will point out that, Sure, Liz has a plan -- Bernie's plan. But corrupt, no.

On Warren and the nom and election, I've already carved out a tiny minority position here. If she emerges with the nom, and it's far too early for predictions on these things, this nice, earnest, schoolmarmish lady would not seem a good candidate going womano-a-mano vs Donald, but I would likely vote for her (and not the 24-time Green loser) and then make plans to move to Iceland, given the inevitable depressing result and impending martial law and suspension of free speech.

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Wally's picture

@wokkamile

She's just going to split the woman's vote with Harris. Take votes away from Biden and Bernie. And then . . . . could Alligator Ed be right about that second ballot? Or a deal struck with Biden?

Is her foreign policy any different than Hillary 2.0? I don't see it. Who's her foreign policy mentor? Maddie Albright, no? Uggggh!

Not that it's going to happen coz she won't get past the convention, but Warren has made it very clear that she will take any kind of money after the primaries.

It will be interesting to see at the next debate if she goes after Biden and/or Bernie.

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

@Wally

with Bernie, and, as I said the other day, CNN reported that The New Yorker reported in December that he and Warren struck a deal--they are going to attack each other during the campaign.

It would seem (to me) that it would include during debates. So, doubt it.

As for Biden, I could be wrong, but, I'm 'guessing' that he's fair game (for all the candidates). Not to mention, it'd probably be easier for Warren to attack him, since she won't be standing by him (or, even on stage with him). Plus, to my knowledge, there're not what you're call friends.

Since Biden still has a 'slim' lead, I'm figuring that he'll be most Everyone's target. They have to know that he's limping along, so, they'll probably (collectively) try to put him out of the race, once and for all.

For sure, it should be a very interesting evening. If Biden doesn't hit a home run, most corporatist 'talking heads' even concede that he'll be toast.

Mollie

“Dogs have given us their absolute all. We are the center of their universe. We are the focus of their love and faith and trust. They serve us in return for scraps. It is without a doubt the best deal man has ever made.
~~Roger Caras

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

Wally's picture

@Unabashed Liberal

I don't think Biden has to hit a home run to win. Obama can pinch hit for him in the late innings and even hit a walk off home run for him with an endorsement if necessary. But that won't be necessary even if Joe is injured as long as he is limping along to victory. Time will tell.

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

@Wally

that I'm hearing, some of his 'big donors' are getting a tad antsy--because he's been dropping precipitously in the polls, especially, since the last Debate.

Regarding 'O' campaigning for him, I'm not convinced he would. Michelle refused just last week to say anything supportive of him, when asked.

First and foremost, IMO, 'O' wants a Dem to be elected who will preserve the ACA, etc. I sorta doubt he'd campaign for Uncle Joe, simply out of affection and/or loyalty.

IOW, if he thinks he can't win, I figure the 'O's' will likely throw him under the Bus.

Hey, think we'll probably know, soon enough.

SmileMollie

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4 users have voted.

Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

Wally's picture

@Unabashed Liberal

My guess is that the plan is to slowly build up and then crescendo early next year for maximum impact.

Today, he was endorsed by Rep. Eddie Bernice Johnson (D-TX),a senior member of the Congressional Black Caucus.

I'm thinking Obama will endorse him only as a last resort and only if absolutely necessary - meaning if the headiest competition is only either Bernie or Warren. Otherwise, Obama can live with whatever loser the party decides upon.

Biden's also still polling ahead in every early state up through Super Tuesday.

Still, how many delegates will he have when all is said and done? Enough to go over the 51% marker? I don't see it happening.

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

@Wally

BiggrinMollie

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

Wally's picture

@Unabashed Liberal @Unabashed Liberal

He's gotta get over that 51% marker somehow but I just don't see how he can do it on his own. Maybe he will but more likely, istm, he'll need to get candidates to release their delegates to him. Maybe that'll happen before the first ballot but if it comes the second ballot, I think hell will break loose if he doesn't secure the nomination on the first ballot. All speculation, of course.

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wendy davis's picture

@wokkamile

'womano-a-mano vs Donald...' is well-done fun, but really, 'mano' is spanish for 'hand', so mano a mano means 'hand to hand'. maybe as in: combat? ; )

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TheOtherMaven's picture

all the time.

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There is no justice. There can be no peace.